Episode Transcript
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[00:01:10] Speaker B: It's time Time for the Burning River Sportscast.
We're approaching critical mass when it comes to the future of the Browns. Things are about as bad as they've been since 1 in 31 fans are deeply entrenched in their camps. We love Shador. We hate Shador. We still believe in two time coach of the year Kevin Stefansk. We hope Kevin disappears into the upside down. Andrew Barry had a good draft. Let's keep him around. Andrew Barry's one decent draft doesn't excuse half a decade of ineptitude. With things spiraling out of control in Cleveland, a complete shakeup seems more likely than ever. But let me just caution those of you in the Shador camp, but also in the let's blow it up and start over camp. It's become increasingly clear that Andrew Barry was instrumental in bringing Shador here and that his relationship with twelve and his father is strong.
If Andrew Barry gets the boot, you can pretty much wave goodbye to any chance of Shador Sanders being your long term answer because he just simply doesn't have the time or the environment through year end to cement himself as the Week 1 starter next season. The only thing he does have is Andrew Berry. We'll break it all down for you next on the Burning River Sportscast.
[00:02:24] Speaker A: Is that what's written there? Are you on the wrong show?
[00:02:27] Speaker B: Are you on the wrong show?
[00:02:28] Speaker A: I don't know.
[00:02:29] Speaker C: It says episode 140.
[00:02:30] Speaker B: Yeah, you're on the wrong show.
[00:02:32] Speaker C: I don't see another one on here.
[00:02:34] Speaker A: He's. He is Shador Sanders. He's got the wrong.
[00:02:37] Speaker B: He's got the wrong wristband.
[00:02:39] Speaker A: I don't think this guy knows what a calf is.
[00:02:41] Speaker B: These people have lost the plot.
[00:02:42] Speaker D: The pass protection was collapsing, the routes weren't winning, the run game wasn't viable.
Situational football was completely broken down. Did that sound like yesterday's game?
[00:02:53] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.
[00:02:54] Speaker D: Jimmy's sitting there watching the same crap that we are. It's his team and he can't be going, oh, I'm so into this right now.
[00:03:02] Speaker E: Is it that they don't like Shador Sanders? Is it that they don't like downfield passing?
[00:03:11] Speaker C: I'm never going to be able to. I'm never going to be able to correct that.
[00:03:14] Speaker B: You can't get that g out of his mind. Back to back to back with John Hughes.
[00:03:17] Speaker A: John Hughes is a regular.
[00:03:18] Speaker B: We got to pull that one off on the next cruise. All three of us pissing with John Hughes.
Welcome in to the Burning River Sportscast presented by the fine folks Happen Media. I'm Kenny Thunder. Joining me today. His family tree looks more like a wreath. He's red hot. Ronnie Jams.
[00:03:40] Speaker A: Is that an incest joke?
[00:03:43] Speaker B: Not on the board today.
He works out everything, including his grapefruits. He's the big bone man.
Bone. What do you call a Roman soldier with hair in his teeth?
[00:03:54] Speaker C: Hungry.
[00:03:55] Speaker B: A gladiator.
[00:04:04] Speaker A: Gladiator.
[00:04:05] Speaker B: Get it.
[00:04:06] Speaker A: I was waiting for Bo to get it, but he never came around to it.
[00:04:09] Speaker C: Yeah, I did not.
[00:04:09] Speaker B: That's a red hot.
Where can our listeners find the dopest dope they ever heard On a podcast. The number one ranked football podcast and all the good pods. The official podcast of dozens of Cleveland Browns backers around the world and the unofficial podcast of Cleveland brownsbackers everywhere.
[00:04:27] Speaker A: You want to know? Yeah, you can find our podcast wherever each podcast, Pocket, Apple podcast, Spotify, stitcher, Amazon Music, YouTube Music, Pandora, iHeartRadio podcast, Castro, where you're number one ranked football podcast. That's on good pods actually. But you can find it in all those places and leave a review on your preferred podcast app. It's the best way you can help us grow. I like how you took away my part. Like I don't even get to say that we're the official brown of some Browns backers somewhere because now you just added into your part.
[00:04:52] Speaker B: Well, we are now the official podcast of dozens of Cleveland Browns backers all around the world.
[00:04:56] Speaker A: That's fair. We're dope shit. And don't forget to subscribe on YouTube. The only place that you can find our video podcast. And check us out on Facebook, Instagram and tick tock our handle for all those socials at BernieVersports. We are on X as well. The handle at Burning Pod. While you're at check out our merch www.thetapmedia.com shop all kinds of stuff in there today on the show. This is what you can look forward to. Hot takes from the hot take hotline the Browns Brief more messages from Macho fan and brownstronaut division roundup and king of the north with John Hughes. He's on with us again tonight, an interview with another Brownsbackers chapter, this time the Toronto Brownsbackers. Keeping with the Canadian theme, we have another edition of Foreign relations with Kenny Ma and of course, the Week 16 preview, which will probably come last. And we don't really care about Guess the bill's probably gonna lose, but. Hey, what's that over there look?
Shut up with that. Let's get things started with the Burning river news story of the week.
[00:05:49] Speaker B: He threw something at me, but he missed.
[00:05:50] Speaker A: I missed badly. This is what happens when you throw with your left hand, Dylan Gabriel. That's true. Left hand.
All right, this week's bring over news story of the week, Sharon Moore.
[00:06:13] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, he had a rough week.
[00:06:16] Speaker A: I just didn't know if I had to say anything else. I think everybody's heard the news at this point.
Obviously, Shiron Moore was apprehended by the police for an alleged assault.
And this thing spiraled out of control pretty quickly. I mean, we started getting the reports of it last week when we were doing our show. You're like, oh man, it's getting worse.
[00:06:36] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:06:36] Speaker A: And so basically, let me give you the rundown real quick. In a nutshell, he was having an affair with his. His executive assistant.
At some point or another, things went south, it sounds like, with the affair. But then simultaneously there was a investigation into the affair.
They found all kinds of evidence that corroborated the affair last week. On Monday, Sharon Moore was fired, citing the affair with cause. Citing the affair and a. What did they call it? A inappropriate relationship with a staffer.
[00:07:15] Speaker B: Yeah, 19 year old staffer.
[00:07:18] Speaker A: And Sherrod Moore proceeded to go to her house, break in, hold her at knifepoint, tell her he was going to kill himself and unalive himself. You might have to edit that out. Unalive him and unalive her after losing his job. It was just. Just wild.
[00:07:38] Speaker B: Yeah. That escalated quickly.
The Ohio State loss, I think broke Siron Moore.
[00:07:43] Speaker A: I actually have in here. Dude lost to Ohio State, lost his side piece, lost his job, lost his wife, and then he lost his mind.
[00:07:48] Speaker B: His family, his kids.
[00:07:49] Speaker A: Yeah, he lost it all.
[00:07:51] Speaker B: Yeah, just.
[00:07:52] Speaker C: But he blamed her. He blamed the side piece.
[00:07:55] Speaker A: I mean, he seems like he did. I don't think he's really talked publicly or like addressed it at all.
But I mean, he did go to her house and like threaten. I think that was more so, like, I don't know what I'm gonna do.
I mean clearly he's not right in the head. He held the, held the young girl at knife point after he caused this whole thing.
[00:08:14] Speaker B: So I mean, absolutely. A case study and what not to do and how to ruin your life in one day.
Right? I mean you did. He did everything wrong.
But you know, this just, this just is Michigan, right? This is Michigan Athletics. And it's just the next in a long string of improprieties that have occurred in that athletic department. I mean you had, you know, obviously the Connor Stallions science stealing scandal, the Harbaugh suspension for illegal recruiting that he dodged and went to the NFL on.
They had the inappropriate relations with a 13 year old girl. They had to fire a staffer for Alex ud. The Matt Weiss computer hacking scandal where he, he left. Allegedly he was spying on over women student athletes all around the country.
Just again, a long string of bad behavior going on in Michigan athletics.
[00:09:14] Speaker A: When you list all this stuff. And it's no coincidence that since the Sharon Moore thing that was kind of like the culmination, like the culmination of this whole thing was, was the Sharon Moore incident. It's still ongoing. We have no idea what the fuck is actually happening right now. He's just being held. He was supposed to have a trial on Friday or at least a hearing on Friday. I don't know if that ever happened. But since then Michigan has launched a full investigation of their entire athletics department.
[00:09:43] Speaker B: Well, yeah, because it's not just. That was just the football list that I named off there. The gymnastics program has had goofy stuff going on. The basketball program, the hockey program had something where their head coach was creating a toxic environment for female employees and harassment stuff. So it's just a, an absolute dumpster fire over there, which is what I would expect from Michigan, which is why I don't give a damn for the whole state.
[00:10:06] Speaker C: It makes a lot of sense.
[00:10:07] Speaker A: Yeah, we don't give a damn for.
[00:10:10] Speaker B: The whole state of Michigan. The whole state of Michigan. The whole state of Michigan. We don't give a damn for the whole state of Michigan because we're from Ohio.
[00:10:21] Speaker A: Look, I actually want to add one thing to this.
Dave Portnoy came out and was like, we need to give these.
Let this thing run its course and learn everything we need to learn and not judge this man as still a human being. Dave Portnoy, shut the fuck up.
[00:10:37] Speaker B: Yeah, Dave Portnoy.
[00:10:37] Speaker A: He would be the first one to shit all over Ohio State guys if the same thing happened.
[00:10:41] Speaker B: Yeah, Dave Portnoy has made a series of really bad takes here recently because of this whole thing to the point where he was like. Of all this was going on in Michigan football and, you know, we beat. We're beating Ohio State. Like, how embarrassing for Ohio State. Like, dude, this program is a mess.
[00:10:58] Speaker A: Yeah, how embarrassing.
[00:10:59] Speaker B: You're gonna try and deflect this to Ohio State somehow in addition to another, you know, bad NFL take, yesterday he was posted a video of him screaming about how New England was the king of the AFC because they were up, you know, 20 or 21 to nothing on Buffalo and the Josh Allen's trash and that New England's just on the brink of another dynasty and that aged poorly as well. So Portnoy's been on really quickly, actually. Yeah.
[00:11:25] Speaker A: That being said, Portnoy, if you see this, give me a call.
[00:11:28] Speaker B: Yeah, give us a go. We'd love to be on your show.
[00:11:29] Speaker A: We'd love to shoot the shit with you.
[00:11:31] Speaker C: I actually make a homemade pizza, Dave. I wouldn't mind if you graded it out for me.
[00:11:36] Speaker B: Give it a shot.
[00:11:37] Speaker A: Yeah. We're invited to try bones.
Bones.
[00:11:40] Speaker B: Bones. The bones.
[00:11:41] Speaker A: Yeah, the bones.
[00:11:42] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:11:43] Speaker A: Dave Portnoy, come and try bones pie.
[00:11:45] Speaker B: Bone, how did we not know that you were making homemade pizza?
[00:11:48] Speaker A: You never brought us.
[00:11:49] Speaker C: It's.
[00:11:50] Speaker A: Have you brought us one?
[00:11:51] Speaker C: I mill my own flour, then I make my own crust and.
[00:11:53] Speaker A: Bullshit.
[00:11:54] Speaker C: I said not a bad pizza.
[00:11:55] Speaker B: Is this real life?
[00:11:56] Speaker A: You make us coffee every week, but you can't bring us a damn pizza?
[00:11:59] Speaker B: Come on, Bone.
[00:11:59] Speaker C: Yeah, the kids like it.
[00:12:00] Speaker A: You know, what about us?
[00:12:04] Speaker C: It's actually not that good.
[00:12:05] Speaker B: Pizza party at Bones.
[00:12:06] Speaker C: My kids are very picky and they'll eat this pizza every and then I.
[00:12:09] Speaker A: Demand you bring in pizza soon.
[00:12:10] Speaker B: You make homemade sauce?
[00:12:12] Speaker C: No, no, just the crust.
[00:12:13] Speaker A: Listen, this is a Browns podcast. Office morale is low.
We need a pizza party.
[00:12:18] Speaker B: A pizza party.
[00:12:19] Speaker C: So I'll bring a pizza.
[00:12:20] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm in. I want to. I want to taste bones pie too.
[00:12:24] Speaker B: Let's taste the bone pie.
[00:12:26] Speaker A: But I don't know where, how we got here, but Michigan sucks. Portnoy, give us a call. Yeah, we'd like to shoot the with you and talk to you.
[00:12:35] Speaker B: We love to host our podcast on your network.
[00:12:37] Speaker A: Yeah, one more thing before we get to the Browns, let me remind everybody, Sports gu call. Leave the high takes on a hot take.
[00:12:44] Speaker B: You don't call, we'll kick you in. Hasms right in the jimmies.
[00:12:48] Speaker A: We got some hot takes. Kenny, do we have a few?
[00:12:50] Speaker B: Yeah, we have some hot takes.
[00:12:51] Speaker A: Do we have one? Do we have two.
[00:12:52] Speaker B: We got a couple.
[00:12:53] Speaker A: Do we have three?
[00:12:53] Speaker B: I'll play them for you here. Are you ready?
[00:12:56] Speaker A: I'm ready.
[00:12:56] Speaker B: Okay, here they go.
[00:12:58] Speaker D: You guys know that I'm not the youngest Browns fan on the planet.
I've been watching this. I'm 64 years old old and I've been watching this for quite some time.
I watched. I remember when we lost to the.
[00:13:16] Speaker A: Let's see, let's go with the Baltimore.
[00:13:18] Speaker D: Colts to go to Super Bowl 3. I remember that game.
I remember when we lost to the Minnesota Vikings to go to Super Bowl 4.
[00:13:29] Speaker B: Or 5.
[00:13:29] Speaker A: Was it.
[00:13:31] Speaker D: We had some really crappy years during the 70s, late 70s.
[00:13:39] Speaker E: And then.
[00:13:41] Speaker D: And then there was the one in 31 stretch.
Today was hands down by far the worst game that I've ever seen the Cleveland Browns ever play in my entire freaking lifetime.
This is just.
[00:14:03] Speaker F: It's.
[00:14:06] Speaker D: Edit this, guys.
Kevin's gotta go and we gotta start all over again.
It's just.
That was the worst game I've ever watched. Worst game I've ever watched as a 64 year old.
All right, about 50 at Stoney's today.
We'll keep it going.
[00:14:43] Speaker A: Love you guys.
[00:14:44] Speaker D: Merry Christmas.
[00:14:46] Speaker A: First things first, I wanna. I wanna let Cliff know that like, grammar and punctuation matter.
So when you say this is the worst game you've watched as a 64 year old. Like so. You've only been 64, like this year.
[00:14:58] Speaker F: One year.
[00:14:58] Speaker A: Like so. It can't be that bad, right?
[00:15:02] Speaker B: I will not edit that out. Cliff. I think that was hilarious. We don't things.
[00:15:05] Speaker A: We let it. We let it roll.
[00:15:06] Speaker B: These are.
[00:15:07] Speaker A: These are uncut takes.
[00:15:08] Speaker B: Yeah, uncut, like running jams.
[00:15:11] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:15:12] Speaker B: So, I mean, obviously a very dejected Cliff.
[00:15:16] Speaker A: He's sad.
[00:15:17] Speaker B: I mean, he. He was just, I think, totally exhausted and out of gas.
[00:15:21] Speaker A: You remember us not going to Super Bowl 3. You. You're really old.
[00:15:25] Speaker B: I was going to say Cliff is bringing up a bunch of bad things from before we were even born.
[00:15:31] Speaker A: I don't remember that shit.
[00:15:32] Speaker B: Glad that he can put that on our radar.
I will disagree that this is the worst Browns loss that I've ever seen. I think this was Jets a couple years ago. Well, I think this was expected, right? Chicago was a good football team. We're a bad football team. I'm not saying that the game was good. It was completely unwatchable.
And that's probably where he was going was. It wasn't so much that it was the worst in terms of the grand scheme of things overall. It was just the Most.
[00:15:56] Speaker A: It was literally unwatchable. There was nothing good that we've ever.
[00:15:59] Speaker B: Seen because nothing good happened. I mean, the Miles Garrett sacks, I guess we're okay, but.
But it was just a terrible game to watch. Yeah, but where does it rank among the worst losses of all time?
I don't know that I can make the case that that one was the worst because I think we all expected them to lose this week.
[00:16:16] Speaker C: Sure.
[00:16:16] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, we all. Well, except for you. We all picked them to lose.
[00:16:21] Speaker B: Thanks.
But always good to hear from Cliff. I'm glad they're still getting 50 plus people out at Stoney's every week. I mean, that's impressive.
[00:16:29] Speaker A: That is impressive.
[00:16:30] Speaker B: Good showing to go. Go out and watch this team that plays games that you can't watch, they.
[00:16:34] Speaker A: Gotta drink up that. That beer that's brewed especially for them.
[00:16:37] Speaker B: That's true. 5280 Cleveland Rocks.
[00:16:39] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:16:40] Speaker B: Go mile high.
[00:16:42] Speaker A: Good job, guys.
[00:16:43] Speaker B: And merry Christmas to you, Cliff.
[00:16:44] Speaker A: Merry Christmas. We love you too.
[00:16:45] Speaker B: Thanks for calling.
Next on the list.
[00:16:49] Speaker A: Good evening, Hot take hotline.
[00:16:52] Speaker B: My opinions are mine and mine alone.
[00:16:54] Speaker A: And do not represent the Browns backers of North Jersey.
[00:16:57] Speaker B: Angry Bobby always has great points in.
[00:16:59] Speaker A: His call and should be admired. Angry Bobby is the best.
My bigger and more important point was.
[00:17:07] Speaker D: More people should call the hot take hotline.
[00:17:10] Speaker A: Thank you and have a good night.
[00:17:13] Speaker B: I'm not sure what happened at the beginning of that. I think there might have been an interruption in the phone line because we missed the first half of whatever menaca was trying to tell us.
[00:17:20] Speaker A: What were his takes last week?
Call the hot take hotline.
[00:17:24] Speaker B: Call the hot take hotline. And that Bobby's bad at it.
[00:17:29] Speaker A: Dang. Did Bobby force him to issue an apology?
[00:17:33] Speaker B: Was that a formal apology from a knock em man?
[00:17:36] Speaker A: And he even said my takes are my takes alone and don't reflect the views of.
Did they go in there and maybe the rest of North Jersey got on him and they were like, we like Bobby. And he was like, oh, maybe, maybe.
[00:17:50] Speaker B: I mean, we've been showing a lot of love to Menachem lately. Maybe Bobby is starting to get jealous.
[00:17:54] Speaker A: Is that what's happening? We got a little love triangle going.
[00:17:57] Speaker B: Has supplanted as our favorite hot take hotliner.
[00:18:01] Speaker A: Dang. Took it to heart and he said knock him. You better go on there and fix this. I guess.
[00:18:06] Speaker B: Call us back next week. Menock him and let her call us. Call us this week and we'll play it on social media or something because we missed the first. First Half of whatever you were trying to say. We had some kind of phone interruption.
[00:18:17] Speaker A: I like that our hot take hotline has its own subplots. Just like what is happening.
[00:18:23] Speaker B: Yeah, let's talk about the next one.
[00:18:25] Speaker A: Morning Bobby Brown backers in North Jersey.
[00:18:30] Speaker B: Once again, another week.
But I continue to call in to show up.
[00:18:38] Speaker A: I can't really say that about our team yesterday, especially our coaches.
[00:18:42] Speaker B: They were so.
[00:18:46] Speaker A: Didn't even like they wanted to be there yesterday.
[00:18:51] Speaker B: No, real hot takes three weeks at.
[00:18:53] Speaker C: The end of the season.
[00:18:54] Speaker B: Thank God we will get to see.
[00:18:59] Speaker A: Our coaches get fired because I think.
[00:19:01] Speaker B: It'S going to happen, start all over again. So we'll have, you know, we'll have a busy January, busy February.
[00:19:09] Speaker A: Who our coaches are going to be.
[00:19:13] Speaker B: That's always fun.
[00:19:14] Speaker A: Trying to guess.
[00:19:18] Speaker B: The only good thing is we're getting closer. The Browns coming to MetLife twice next year.
[00:19:28] Speaker D: That's right.
[00:19:29] Speaker B: Browns will play a MetLife against the.
[00:19:31] Speaker A: Giants and the defense, that'll be fun.
[00:19:36] Speaker B: Also. One thing I want to take, maybe.
[00:19:38] Speaker A: This could be my hot take.
You know, the Bears and the Patriots.
[00:19:42] Speaker B: Really weren't good last year.
[00:19:44] Speaker A: They turned around pretty quickly.
So maybe if we get a new.
[00:19:48] Speaker B: Coach come in, maybe we can turn around quickly.
Miles Garrett's got one more sack to tie it, two to get the new record.
[00:19:59] Speaker A: So we'll look forward to that this.
[00:20:00] Speaker B: The rest of this year.
[00:20:03] Speaker A: That's it.
Have a great week.
Talk to you again next week.
That was it. I'm glad that he said the whole thing with teams turn it around every year because at the end of Cliff's call, I was sitting there thinking. I was like, I had a point that I wanted to make here and I couldn't remember what it was. It was that look at the bright side. Because he was. Because Cliff had the same complaint. He said, you know, we're going to be starting over. But you say it all the time. Teams go, go from worst to first every year. It just takes the right personnel. So if we're able to get a head coach that, that it actually works out, who knows, we could be talking next year. We could be sitting here talking about playoffs with Shador Sanders in the playoffs.
[00:20:45] Speaker B: Yeah, I agree. That was my favorite part of the call as well, because I. I'm a huge proponent of that. I think if you have the right coach and you bring in the right players, like, and maybe you don't win the super bowl that year, but you can turn it around to the point where you can start to see growth and a real Path forward.
And, you know, sometimes that's one year, sometimes it's two. But it can be done quickly. This league is built for parody. It's built to be able to turn your team around quickly. With the way the draft is stacked, the way free agency works now, like, you. You have the capacity, if you do things the right way, to become a good football team. It's almost.
It's almost harder to. We do talk about this all the time. It's harder to be bad for this length of time consistently because you have to almost actively be trying to be bad. Because the way the league is set up, it is set up for you to succeed and to grow and to get better.
[00:21:38] Speaker A: I guess the only caveat to that is the league's also set up to let you score 20 points.
[00:21:42] Speaker B: Well, we can't do that either, so. But yeah.
What do you do? This team sucks right now. It's hard to watch.
[00:21:53] Speaker A: Yeah. Is that all the hot takes?
[00:21:55] Speaker B: Bobby's certainly excited about the Browns coming to New York twice next year.
So that's good. I guess.
[00:22:02] Speaker A: Hopefully before then, you know, between his call and Monocum's call, they can figure something out.
[00:22:07] Speaker B: Hopefully they can.
[00:22:09] Speaker A: Well, no, I was actually going with. Hopefully North Jersey in general can figure something out with their cell phone coverage, because it was shite.
[00:22:15] Speaker B: Yeah, I was gonna say that as well. That there's something going on in. In the air up there. A bad cell phone, tire tower, polar vortex. That could have been. It was really cold this weekend. All over the place. It froze the phone lines.
[00:22:26] Speaker A: Was that all the hot takes?
[00:22:27] Speaker B: That was all the hot takes this week. So as always, we appreciate the callers. You make the show.
[00:22:31] Speaker A: You know who wasn't. Wasn't in there? Kevin. He probably left at halftime.
[00:22:35] Speaker B: I'm sure that he was disgusted and couldn't finish watching this game.
Yeah.
[00:22:40] Speaker A: Kevin, you leave another game at halftime, I might have to drop a hard pee on you.
[00:22:43] Speaker B: Weak shit, Kevin.
[00:22:44] Speaker F: Weak shit.
[00:22:45] Speaker A: It's weak.
But, yeah, that's the hot take hotline. So remember, get your hot takes in three. 3022-780813-30227-8081-3302-2278-0813-3022 78, 081-Call- now. Not standing by. But we will put those hot takes on the air and talk about them. Speaking of hot takes, it's time for dig it with the macho fan.
[00:23:16] Speaker B: Buffalo Bills. Yeah. Coming to town. Coming in herds. But don't worry. Cause the dog pound is waiting for You. That's right. Yeah. It's our time. It's our time in the big time.
[00:23:28] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:23:29] Speaker B: With a cup of coffee, that is. And we are thirsty for a win. We were thirsty for that sack record. So let's go Duck pound. Let's come in and show them that we're down, but we're not out. And we're gonna bring the. The noise. Yeah.
Gold PR It.
[00:23:48] Speaker F: Yeah.
[00:23:56] Speaker A: Macho.
[00:23:57] Speaker B: Macho fan.
I want to be a macho fan.
[00:24:06] Speaker A: I don't know why that's the go to.
[00:24:07] Speaker B: He's always bringing the heat every week.
[00:24:09] Speaker A: Yeah, he's always bringing it. He's. He's the only one that's excited for week 16, but, you know, I'm here for it. He's part of the show.
[00:24:15] Speaker B: I love Macho fan. I gotta go back to the hot take hotline real quick. There was one final thing I wanted to say. Bobby mentioned that this could be an interesting January and February, and generally that's kind of when we start to slow down. We kind of COVID through the super bowl just to cover the. The playoffs and the happenings around the league.
[00:24:30] Speaker A: Shorter shows around that time.
[00:24:31] Speaker B: Shorter shows. But he's right. This could be an elongated.
You know, we'll see what happens to the coaching search. If that happens, we may have a lot to talk about as we head into the end of the NFL calendar here.
[00:24:44] Speaker A: Yeah. Interesting stuff.
[00:24:46] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.
[00:24:47] Speaker A: It's typical Browns. Our season starts when everybody else's season ends.
[00:24:52] Speaker B: That's the problem. We're on. We're on the wrong schedule. We need to be like Shador and get on schedule.
[00:24:56] Speaker A: Is it because. Yeah. We think we're part of, like, the UFL or whatever it's called now.
[00:25:00] Speaker B: We're playing for spring football.
[00:25:01] Speaker A: Yeah. I don't know what we're doing, but anyways, macho fans, dog. Let's talk about some other dogs. I'm talking about the Burning River Sportscast.
[00:25:09] Speaker B: Dog of the Week.
To play tough people in the National Football League, you got to be ready and we got to be the dogs.
[00:25:21] Speaker F: That we are every time we step.
[00:25:23] Speaker B: On there on Sunday and be ready to attack. And don't stop until we're in that locker room.
[00:25:32] Speaker A: All right, so for the Burger Sportscast Dog of the Week, we leave it up to our listeners and followers to determine who is the dog of the week. Each week on our live shows on Sunday night, we each nominate a dog of the week candidate. From there, we turn it over to all of you on our socials to vote and make the Final decision. This week's nominees. Kenny Ib Bone.
[00:25:50] Speaker B: Ah.
[00:25:51] Speaker A: Harold Fanning Jr. No, it was not him.
[00:25:53] Speaker B: Fanning every time.
[00:25:55] Speaker A: That wasn't your guy. It was Carson.
[00:25:56] Speaker C: All right, well, Carson, it's what's written here.
[00:26:00] Speaker A: It's not what's written there. Are you on the wrong show?
[00:26:02] Speaker B: Are you on the wrong show?
[00:26:04] Speaker C: I don't know. It says episode 140.
[00:26:06] Speaker A: Yeah, you're on the wrong show.
[00:26:07] Speaker C: I don't see another one on here.
[00:26:09] Speaker A: This is episode 142.
Bones nominee is Carson Schweisingr. And mine was Miles Garrett. And after the fan vote that was conducted today on our socials, this week's Burning over sportscast dog of the week is Miles Garrett.
You probably didn't know that was coming either.
[00:26:29] Speaker C: I knew that because you guys said it earlier. And I was like, I'm reading this. I'm like, this isn't right. You know, nothing's up to date.
[00:26:34] Speaker A: I don't know what's going on.
He's. He is Shador Sanders. He's got the wrong.
[00:26:39] Speaker B: He's got the wrong wristband.
[00:26:41] Speaker A: We didn't even get to that yet. That's coming up. Almost perfect.
[00:26:44] Speaker C: Here's the thing. Like, I just made a note tonight, and it's updated and the note isn't in here. I don't. I don't know what's going on.
[00:26:52] Speaker B: So dang well, Bono get himself right, but let's be honest, I don't have the note. IB And Schwessinger were honorable mentions at best here. The only reason people are watching right now is because of Miles Garrett.
[00:27:02] Speaker A: He had four tackles, two solo, one tackle for loss, three quarterback hits, and one and a half sacks. So he is now one sack shy of tying the record away. And. And one and a half. Everybody says two, but he's really one and a half away from breaking it. So.
[00:27:19] Speaker B: And as we know, half sacks can happen because we just watched it.
[00:27:23] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. So good job, Miles Garrett. You're almost there.
And we'll talk about whether or not we'll get there here in just a.
[00:27:30] Speaker B: Couple more half sacks.
[00:27:31] Speaker A: Yep, let's go ahead and get into the Browns brief.
All right, now that we've got Bone finally on the right page here, let's go ahead and get into the Browns brief. Brown brief. All right, so the Browns have dropped Garrett Dillinger and added back Jamari Thrash. Interesting move here. One of the few people that was protecting or trying to protect Shador Sanders this past week has been dropped.
[00:28:05] Speaker B: Our four string right guard is officially Been cut.
[00:28:07] Speaker A: Is this, like, the point where they're like, we don't know what's worse, the fact that we have no linemen or the fact that we have no wide receivers?
[00:28:13] Speaker B: I mean, I think at the point in which the offensive lineman that blocked for you on Sunday to get cut the following day, like, it's a pretty good indication of where you're at in the season fair. And I think it's hard to really, truly get an evaluation on your young quarterback at that point.
[00:28:29] Speaker A: Yeah, it's just a sign of the times, I guess.
[00:28:33] Speaker B: Sign of the times.
[00:28:35] Speaker A: We already talked about Miles Garrett and where he stands with the record. I do want to touch on this point, though. Is he injured because you saw him kind of like, punching his.
[00:28:45] Speaker B: Well, the commentator said he was punching his calf.
[00:28:47] Speaker A: Oh, well, that commentator is an idiot. I text you immediately. I was like, I don't think this guy knows what a calf is.
[00:28:51] Speaker B: Yeah, he was. He was pounding out his quad there for a minute, and.
And. And on the next opportunity that he had to chase Caleb Williams, he really had a hard time getting home, and he didn't get home, and Caleb Williams very easily outran him to the sideline.
[00:29:07] Speaker A: Yeah, so just. Just something of concern, I would say. Hopefully it's. It's something minor. Maybe it was cramping or whatever the case may be. I mean, he'. Big thighs.
[00:29:16] Speaker B: He does have big, big quads.
[00:29:18] Speaker C: If you got a bruise or something like that, I mean, you can be limping on that for a minute. So.
[00:29:22] Speaker A: True.
[00:29:23] Speaker C: A week to heal. Hopefully that's, you know, something like that. Just a deep bruise or.
[00:29:27] Speaker B: I just have to think that if he wasn't one sack away from the. The record at this point in the season with his team being asked, like, that's. It's probably something that he may sit out on just to preserve himself, but knowing he's so close, like, if he was. If he had 12 sacks this season, my guess is he wouldn't play this week, week, or maybe the rest of the season because he looked hampered.
So, you know, I think that he figures probably by default, just by being in the mix on defensive line, he'll probably. Because. Because, let's be honest, a 50% miles Garrett is as good as about half the league at defensive end. So he probably figures he's. He's by default going to at least be in the mix and get a sack and a half to get the record.
[00:30:04] Speaker A: So I think we're all kind of. Of. Of the same thought process. We think we're Going to get it. When do you think he gets it? We'll start with you, Ken.
[00:30:11] Speaker B: I think he gets it this week.
[00:30:13] Speaker A: Think it's this week. You think he's gonna be fired up to get, to get the job done?
[00:30:16] Speaker B: Just because if nothing else, Josh Allen is the type of quarterback that extends the play. And those are the types of plays that Miles, you know, does chase those guys down frequently. And so when you have a quarterback back there dancing around, trying to make something happen, I think, I think it suits well for Miles's pass rush.
[00:30:36] Speaker A: Yeah, Bones.
[00:30:37] Speaker C: No, I would second that. I think he's going to have opportunities to get to Josh Allen just the way they pass the ball and the way as Mr. Thunder talked about. Yeah, he's back there looking for plays, keeping his eye downfield, stepping up in the pocket, you know, whatever it may be.
[00:30:51] Speaker A: Yeah, I think he gets to this week, too. I would be, I would, I'm sorry. I would not be surprised if he didn't, simply because we can't stop the run all of a sudden. So they might not pass that often.
True.
[00:31:02] Speaker B: Well, and the weather is a wild card right now as well. I mean, we don't know. It's been obviously freezing cold here and everywhere, but who knows if, you know, we'll get another snowstorm come into town or if conditions will be better this week. But, but I just think he's, he's, he's the best player on the field.
He can get two sacks anytime he wants to. Just going to be. Can he get home?
[00:31:24] Speaker A: Yep, absolutely. So, and I guess follow up question to that real quick. Does he get to 25 like you said he was going to.
[00:31:31] Speaker B: I think 25 is a hard bet. I think 23, 24 is probably where he ends up for the year. Just because you are starting to run out of time. This team looked disinterested this week. I think the only interest they have in finishing this season outside of the paycheck is seeing Miles get the record. So.
And if he is hampered at all, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets to 23 or 24 if he sits out a week or two here at the end of the season just to not strain himself anymore. Final number, I'll say 24 on the season.
[00:31:59] Speaker A: Bone.
[00:32:00] Speaker C: Hmm. I'm gonna go. Let's, let's say, I'll say 25. Let's see it.
[00:32:04] Speaker A: I think he's gonna get 27.
[00:32:06] Speaker B: Oh.
I mean, I said 30 before the.
[00:32:10] Speaker A: Year, and I thought I was in. I thought, I, I, I thought I was insane when I said 30.
[00:32:15] Speaker B: If he plays the whole year, that Bengals offensive line is vulnerable. And Joe Burrow is another guy that does stand back there and try to make plays. So he could have a two or three sack game against Cincinnati for sure.
[00:32:25] Speaker A: Yep. So, okay, moving on, multiple other podcasts calling for Jim Schwartz to be fired now this week.
Defense obviously bad the last few weeks, but I mean, I don't know, guys like, to me, I think let's pump the brakes here a second.
You know, coming into this past week, they were still the number two ranked defense. And I saw a lot of posts like, oh, I hate when they say that they're number two ranked defense. They haven't been that for a while.
No, the fact is that right now they're the number. They were the number two ranked defense coming into this game. And like, I get it, there was a couple less than stellar games.
But my whole thing is it's week 15 and your offense has given you nothing the entire year. To me, it has nothing to do with Jim Schwartz and maybe teams starting to figure out the defense. It's the fact that the D, the defense has finally had enough and they're like, we just don't give a shit anymore.
[00:33:20] Speaker B: Well, when you talk about the offense putting the defense in bad positions, how about the special teams? The first drive for Chicago started on the 50.
[00:33:26] Speaker A: Like at one point you could say the offense put us in bad position. We could, okay, we could with this. But then when the other two, when they're both putting in a bad position now, it's like, what are we doing?
[00:33:35] Speaker B: They're guarding short fields all of the time.
And you know, to your point, right, the, the defense is still ranked number two even in the games where they're giving up a bunch of points right now. I mean, came Ward through for what, 115 yards against us? So they didn't give up many yards there, so that's going to help your ranking. And Caleb Williams had a good game, but it wasn't like he threw for 450 on him. No, he had a, he had a above average game for an NFL quarterback, I'd say. But it wasn't a lights out, top performance of the year type game.
So this defense is still very much intact. They were missing Denzel Ward this week.
[00:34:09] Speaker A: 242 yards, two touchdowns.
[00:34:11] Speaker B: Yeah, they're missing Denzel Ward this week. Malik Collins went out a couple weeks ago, so there's some attrition there just as the season goes on. And you know, also guys are Banged up so short field from special teams. Offense not helping you out. Defense on the field a lot and the guys getting hurt, injured around all, all around the place. Like they're fortunate that they've been able to put up the performances they have over the last couple of weeks to, to remain a top five defense in the league.
[00:34:36] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:34:37] Speaker B: So I don't have any ill feeling or ill will against Jim Schwartz at this point. I think he's been kind of the one, you know, bright spot of this team is keeping this defensive unit competitive all year despite every. I mean, Jesus, this, this defense was playing with Joe Flacco on the other side of the ball for part of the season. That couldn't do anything. Dylan Gabriel on the other side of the ball and they couldn't do anything, I mean, to the point where they literally could not move the ball at all.
Shador has been a slight improvement over there, but Shador is a rookie and they haven't been great on offense. They've been three and out a lot.
[00:35:07] Speaker A: So we said all along it doesn't matter who's on, who's the quarterback because.
[00:35:11] Speaker B: The offensive scheme sucks.
[00:35:12] Speaker A: Yeah, it's terrible. So you are where you are and you're going to stay there because the offense is bad and the special teams is bad and here. So all this, I guess just to say, like it doesn't really matter at the end of the day because if Kevin Stefanski is gone and Bubba Ventrone is gone, gone, chances are Jim Schwartz is going to be gone as well.
[00:35:29] Speaker B: Clean house. They'll clean house.
[00:35:30] Speaker A: I hope. Well, and I hope that whoever they do hire is the new head coach if we get to that point. I hope they do give him a look and say, yeah, we're open to bringing you back as defensive quarter. You guys have been fantastic the last few years.
[00:35:42] Speaker B: It's the one thing that I feel bad when I think about moving forward and I do want Kevin Stefanski gone. The one thing that I do feel bad about is the potential that you lose Jim Schwartz out of this equation because he's been, he's been stellar since he's been here.
[00:35:56] Speaker A: Ye.
[00:35:57] Speaker B: And I don't know, maybe that says more about Jim Schwartz than then. I'd like to believe that he, you know, has some kind of loyalty to Kevin and believes in what's going on in the building. I don't know, maybe that's a negative in and of itself, but this defense has every reason and the opportunity and potential to be the 25th ranked defense in the league. This Year. Yeah, they very easily could just pack it in and say, you know, hey.
[00:36:23] Speaker A: Well, I'll say this. We've talked a lot about how you can only be so good on defense for so long because teams adjust well. He had the number one defense two years ago.
Last year, they had somewhat of a down here. It wasn't terrible, but they finished like middle of the pack, like 12, somewhere around there. And then he came back this year and had them once again as the number two defense in the league up until this week, basically coming into this game.
[00:36:46] Speaker B: And I can't remember now if it was total yards or passing yards, but they were giving up less yards than the 2000 Ravens defense. Yeah, it's pretty good. At the same point in the season.
[00:36:56] Speaker A: You mentioned, you don't know what that says about Jim Schwartz.
I think what it says is he likes being on a coaching staff with Kevin Stefanski simply because, have you seen Jim Schwartz? He's ripped, he's jacked now. He was like, I had to coach alongside this young, handsome coach, and I have to really be on my game. You know, I got to step it up. And he, I mean. I mean, night and day difference between when he was a head coach to what he looks like now. So, yeah, I'm just saying, with the.
[00:37:22] Speaker B: Resume that he has over the last couple of years with this Browns defense, he could have went other places and been a defensive coordinator. I mean, I'm sure there were opportunities. So the fact that he's stuck around, I'm grateful that he has because we've been able to watch some very good defenses play here, but I don't know.
I don't know.
[00:37:41] Speaker A: All right, so moving on. Jason Whitlock, one of our favorite Shador haters, this week, posted the response from Shador in the press conference when asked about Jerry Judy, and to which the.
[00:37:52] Speaker B: Question first off to Shador was essentially, did he get in Jerry Judy's face after the dropped touchdown turned interception? To which Shador replied, you know, he knows he's got to make that play. It's a big play. He's hard on himself. Like, why would I pile on? Which I thought was a pretty fair answer to a really dumb question.
[00:38:12] Speaker A: And that was it. There wasn't anything. There was no elaboration. No. Like, like, no. The worst thing that he said in there was he knows he needs to make that play.
[00:38:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:38:21] Speaker A: And Jason Whitlock, his response to this whole thing was, quote, absolutely unreal. He backed a bus over Judy while claiming not to bring back the Wonderlic.
[00:38:31] Speaker B: I mean, this is just a guy that just hates Shador for being Shador.
[00:38:34] Speaker A: Yeah, clearly.
[00:38:35] Speaker C: What do you. What are you supposed to say to that? I mean, right. Yes. It's okay that he dropped that.
[00:38:41] Speaker B: Yeah, we drop balls all the time is what we do here.
[00:38:45] Speaker A: I mean, he wouldn't be wrong. But Jason Whitlock, when did he play?
[00:38:49] Speaker B: It's good. It's got to be a minute.
[00:38:51] Speaker A: So he probably played with, like, Deion Sanders. I would say so. This sounds like some sort of resentment that he probably has towards Dion or the whole family.
[00:38:59] Speaker B: And Dion's a polarizing guy. Look, Dion was a polarizing guy when he played, but that's also part of what makes. Made him great. Right? His brash attitude and just confidence that he could go out and make any play. And. And for some people, that rubs you the wrong way. I mean, I don't know what it is about Dion that people hate so much. If. If it's the fact that he wears male diapers, like, I don't know, adult diapers. Not male diapers. They make diapers for boys and girls, but adult diapers.
[00:39:23] Speaker A: Like, I don't know, sex diapers.
[00:39:24] Speaker B: I don't know. Like, is it his success at every level that he's like, is he just one of those guys? Guys, like, we talk about Pat McAfee and, like, how everything he touches turns to gold. Like, Deion Sanders was a great player.
[00:39:36] Speaker A: That's actually probably a good comparison. They have similar personalities. Like. Like, they talk. I mean, I don't know.
[00:39:43] Speaker B: Like, probably the same people that hate Pat McAfee, hate Dion Sanders just because they hate seeing other people succeed. I. I don't. I don't know what else done to anyone that is, like, unforgivable that so many people hate this guy.
[00:39:56] Speaker A: And as far as current generation, like, I keep saying this, like, you throw Jackson dart and Shador Sanders are like, the same guy.
[00:40:06] Speaker B: Well, I think there's a lot of guys you can throw in that. In that mix. Guys. Guys like Baker Mayfield. Get. Get. There's another one of that. I mean, anybody that exhibits any kind of confidence and, like, I don't know if we were just spoiled for so long because we had guys in the league like Peyton Manning, guys like Drew Brees, guys like Tom Brady, who.
[00:40:26] Speaker A: It's a different world now.
[00:40:27] Speaker B: Very much played the consummate professional, always said and did the right things and never showed any emotion.
And even that's unfair because I remember Peyton Manning calling his kicker a dumb kicker for missing kicks.
[00:40:42] Speaker A: Mike Vanderjagt like, all the things with him yelling at Jeff Saturday or whatever.
[00:40:47] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:40:47] Speaker B: I mean, there's stories about Peyton kicking guys out of the huddle because they dropped the ball. Like.
Like these, these guys are all competitors and all playing at the top of the game.
[00:40:55] Speaker A: I mean, Tom Brady's more than anybody I know.
[00:40:57] Speaker B: Tom Brady has plenty of cutscenes of him slamming a helmet or even. Even having fierce conversations with Bill Belichick on the sideline.
There was. I remember the clip of Tom Brady getting yelled at by Belichick, and Brady was like, I hit the guy in the hands. He's supposed to catch the ball.
[00:41:12] Speaker A: You got Philip Rivers that just came back. And they talk about, like, he's a. He's just a world class trash talker.
[00:41:17] Speaker B: Like, yeah, Jay Cutler was another guy that people confidently.
I don't. I don't know. People just hate outward confidence.
[00:41:25] Speaker A: Yeah. I don't know what it is, but Jason Whitlock, you're an idiot.
On the other end of the Shador feelings, Poly Market is reporting that the feeling around Berea is that they will forego drafting a quarterback and build around Shador. The fact that this is out there is kind of surprising if you ask me. Like, especially at this point. Like, I don't. I don't know if that's. You know, we talk about the constant back and forth between Barry and Stefanski and the obvious rift that's there now.
Is this Barry's camp, like, leaking out? Like, no, this is where we should go, like, just further along, getting Kevin Stefanski out the door. Like, I don't know. I'm just asking.
[00:42:01] Speaker B: It was a surprising report, and that's all it is at this point is a hearsay report. So we're not even sure the validity of it, but obviously it was reported in social media, so it's something to talk about. But.
And I don't want to foreshadow too much, but obviously we have a conversation with Kenny Mack here coming up, and there was an interesting point that's come up here, which is potentially, I know a lot of people want them to draft a quarterback in the first round here, but potentially, are some of your moves limited still by the fact that Deshaun Watson is on this roster? And so you already have Shadora under contract.
Does it make sense to move forward with a guy that's here that's making peanuts versus, you know, taking a.
They would probably to get Mendoza, have to trade up and make him the first overall.
[00:42:50] Speaker A: So you're losing draft capital and making him the first overall pick and having.
[00:42:54] Speaker B: To pay him a top contract in the draft.
[00:42:57] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:42:57] Speaker B: So all wrapped up in your quarterback. Maybe, maybe that, maybe that's starting to play a part of this is they're thinking about, hey, we do need to make moves in free agency to solidify.
[00:43:07] Speaker A: If you take a guy next year, then it's only one year before he's. Before DeSean Watson's off the books.
[00:43:13] Speaker B: Yeah. And maybe you start to get creative with the cap stuff there and you can do something about the money, but the fact of the matter is you still have $40 million a year wrapped up in a guy that's not playing for your franchise.
[00:43:22] Speaker A: Yeah.
So it just be interesting to see as we get into draft season here next up here.
Last week a report came out from none other than residents Stefanski fangirl herself, Mary Kay Cabot, that Kevin Stefanski is the reason why Shador has progressed so quickly. Supposedly he's been staying late with Shador in office almost nightly to make sure that, that Sanders is progressing and getting the offense.
This is bullshit. I say bullshit.
He spent so much time working with him that he forgot to have his wristband updated before the game on Sunday.
[00:43:58] Speaker B: I have two questions here and I guess it's not clear based on her article and what she wrote, but I guess the first one is, so are we saying that Kevin Stefanski is staying late every day with Shador and working with him? Is that. Is that since Shador has taken over as a starting quarterback? Because to me that's kind of like waiting all semester to study for your final and then three days before the final you're like, well, shit, now I got to read this whole textbook and do all these worksheets and figure out what the hell went on in this classroom all semester long. Which I don't think is a good look for Stefanski, that we're cramming now to try and make it work. And if this was this has been going on all year. If Stefanski was truly saying, hey, look, Shedor wasn't getting reps with the first team, but his development is important to me and this franchise in what should be a red shirt year.
If this has been going on all year, why not leak this story earlier?
Why not tell everybody?
[00:44:57] Speaker A: Think about the first time we heard this is in week 15.
[00:45:00] Speaker B: Think about the drama that's unfolded to the point where people are calling you racist.
That if you just would have said.
[00:45:07] Speaker A: In training camp, no, I'm with this.
[00:45:09] Speaker B: Guy every day is not the guy we're not expecting him to play this year. But you know what? I'm gonna spend time after practice and at night in the meeting room to try and get this kid where he needs to be. All of that stuff goes away, people go, okay, there's a plan here. We see the writing on the wall that there is some effort to develop this kid. Why wait until week 15 to let this be a news story?
[00:45:32] Speaker A: Because it didn't happen.
[00:45:33] Speaker B: Because it didn't. That's the only plausible explanation. Because it didn't happen. And if it did, it's cramming the night before the final, which is a terrible.
[00:45:42] Speaker A: Look, Bonnie, think this happened?
[00:45:44] Speaker C: Well, no, but I also just think it's a part of being an NFL football coach. Like, I. I don't know. They've been trying to pass this narrative since Shador has been a starter that, you know, what were the extra dog reps or something after practice? They talked about. They kept pushing.
[00:46:00] Speaker B: Hungry dogs.
[00:46:01] Speaker C: Yeah, the hungry dogs.
They literally took time on the broadcast to talk about that. Yeah, I think it was like, his.
[00:46:08] Speaker B: First full start, which, you know, is something that they talked to them about in the game, in the week leading up to the game to say, hey, we want to make sure you're aware of this. So you talk about it on the broadcast.
[00:46:18] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:46:19] Speaker C: I don't know. Just making. Making sure your quarterback understands the playbook after not practicing or getting first team reps the entire year just seems like a logical thing to do. Honestly, like, why is this even a new story? But it's just this PR push from. From. From the Browns cabinet or Cabot cabinet.
[00:46:37] Speaker B: Yeah, this is your point, right? I mean, you, your head coach, and your quarterback should be on the same page. Like, why are we giving accolades for doing your damn job?
[00:46:46] Speaker A: Good job, guys.
No, it's exactly what you said. Bonus is this PR push to make Stefanski or the Browns or whoever look good. And we know for anybody that's like, that doesn't happen, like, literally. We just talked about it last week. Lima came out and said it. He said, well, they gave me this story and I just repeated it.
[00:47:04] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:47:05] Speaker A: Without checking anything. I have. I hadn't seen either of these guys throw. Talking about Dylan Gabriel and Shador Sanders, I hadn't seen either of these guys throw in person, but they were telling me that Shador Sanders was way behind and doing Gabriel looked good. So that's what I ran.
[00:47:18] Speaker B: And we keep acting like this quarterback situation was normal in some way. If you're Stefanski and you. You have Joe Flacco, Kenny Pickett, Dylan Gabriel and Shador Sanders. Two rookies in your quarterback room and four quarterbacks on your basically your active roster. To start the season, like, you have to handle things differently. We can't act like this is normal and that, you know, Shoulders should just take advantage of the reps that he's getting in practice because that's all he's going to get. You have to spend extra time with that guy if you have any interest in developing him whatsoever.
[00:47:52] Speaker A: And even more so, after two weeks into the season, it's apparent that this time team is not good at all.
[00:47:56] Speaker B: Right. Right.
[00:47:58] Speaker A: Yeah. So next up here, the media is starting to ask Kevin Stefanski what he thinks will happen when the season ends, kind of alluding to whether or not he will be fired. He says he won't talk about that and that's not his focus, which I've heard that before.
It's so much not his focus that he's leaking stories about how he's staying after practice to hang out with the quarterback and get him up to speed. Speed. So he's leaking stories about how if he were to leave the Browns, everybody would want him.
[00:48:26] Speaker B: Kevin's a leaky guy.
[00:48:27] Speaker A: Yeah, no, I just, just.
[00:48:30] Speaker B: It is interesting too that all of a sudden we're getting these weird leaks out of Berea because this, it's like one after the other administration, this front office for the most part has been tight lipped on a lot of these things and for, for the duration of their tenure here. And all of a sudden we're starting to get weird shit leaks like this.
[00:48:48] Speaker A: Yeah. And it's, it's because.
[00:48:50] Speaker B: Because people are getting desperate.
[00:48:51] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And, and, and I think it's a chess match between Barry and Stefanski to see who keeps their job. And I think, I think it's pretty clear that Barry has the. As the lead as far as hanging on to his job in, in.
[00:49:04] Speaker B: The Cleveland media for the most part has been delinquent on a lot of things here and been shitty with the way this quarterback situation has been mishandled and with Stefanski's failures as a head coach.
[00:49:14] Speaker A: Coach.
[00:49:14] Speaker B: The one thing that they did do in training camp was push Jimmy Haslam that you know, what is an acceptable, you know, season this year to kind of keep things intact. And Jimmy did say 3 and 14 is not going to cut it. And you're right there, my friend.
[00:49:30] Speaker A: Talk about desperation. Like, I need to win one more.
[00:49:33] Speaker B: Gotta win one more.
[00:49:36] Speaker A: Yeah. But just good that the media is starting to ask Kevin Stiski because we've, we've all been saying. Saying for four years now that Kevin Stefanski needs to go and the fact that the media is starting to ask you what you think is going to happen when the season ends, usually when that happens, you don't have much time.
[00:49:48] Speaker B: So yeah, keep, keep that in the back of your mind as you're listening to all these other media outlets and all these other Browns podcasts have been riding Kevin Stefanski's dick for the last four years. I've said from the moment that they traded for Deshaun Watson, these people have lost the plot.
[00:50:03] Speaker A: It was even before that I went back before that. It was from after, after the year they went to the playoffs with Baker and we pointed it out. We specifically said that Kevin Stefanski is no Mike Tomlin or any of these greater coaches in the NFL and his offensive scheme sucked and that. That they won games in spite of him.
[00:50:22] Speaker B: We said at the time we would rather have Mike Tomlin.
[00:50:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:50:25] Speaker B: And that remains welcome. I hope Pittsburgh fires my welcome and he comes to Cleveland.
[00:50:31] Speaker A: Yeah. So, so speaking of which, good segue head coaching candidates.
Dewey asked us for a short list on our live show last night and we told him we weren't going to give it to him until now, until this show. So I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to start with Bone. Bone, we're going to start with you. Give us a sh. Give us your short list of head coaching candidates that you would like to see at least interviewed for the job, potentially in the job if Kevin Stefanski were to be let go.
[00:50:58] Speaker C: So Joe Brady, offense coordinator for Buffalo, he took over in the 2023 year in November and then since then he's been promoted as full time offense coordinator and they've whatever they've been successful with Josh Allen, that organization. So just being a part of that, maybe a young up and comer could. Could help help the Browns work with Shador and turn things around here.
[00:51:22] Speaker A: I like Joe Brady a lot.
[00:51:23] Speaker C: The other two guys, I'm. I'm more so leaning towards. I kind of like having somebody who's done it before and maybe has learned from the past. And I think these two guys, Cliff Kingsbury and Matt Nagy were both kind of casualties of COVID football I think and bad quarterback play.
Kingsbury is, is known to be whatever working with QBs and he was, we've heard that before. He was in. Yeah, he was in Arizona.
He worked with, with Baker as a freshman I guess at Texas Tech. I saw Caleb Williams and then he, he, he did some good work with Jaden Daniels. I know Daniels have been hurt this year, but last year was, was really nice for him.
And then Matt Nagy I think might be my, my favorite.
He's an offensive coordinator for the Chiefs. He's been and has won a couple Super Bowls with the team.
[00:52:13] Speaker A: Chiefs offense looks pretty bad, right?
[00:52:15] Speaker C: He was, he was with Chicago. You know, he had Mitch Trubisky and Justin Field Fields and he, he coached during COVID and maybe he could turn things around later on just learning from a few things and maybe Shador, you know, works out a little better for him.
[00:52:29] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:52:29] Speaker B: Trubisky was trash.
[00:52:31] Speaker A: He's really bad.
Okay.
[00:52:33] Speaker B: It's great facial hair though.
Stunningly handsome.
[00:52:40] Speaker C: I don't know if any of those guys are going to be great or great coaches, but those are three I saw. I thought they looked interesting.
[00:52:46] Speaker F: That's fair.
[00:52:46] Speaker A: That's fair. I have a list of five here.
I've got Robert Sala, defensive coordinator, 49ers. We've actually already talked about this on the show a little bit and I think that him coming in and possibly adding to, you know, Jim Schwartz defensive scheme, he's a guy that could come in and potentially keep Jim Schwartz and then they kind of mix it up and keep their defense as a just dominant force in the NFL here. So. And the biggest thing I like about Robert Sala is he's like a. No nonsense. Like, like, like he, he'll hold you accountable. Like the thing that we haven't had forever. He'll hold you accountable.
He, he's just says it as it is. He's. He's not going to sit here and tell you, well, that starts with me and we, we need to get that fixed and we're going to get that fixed and then we never get it fixed. He's not going to do that. So I like Robert Sala and he keep, keeps receipts. We talk shit to him one time and then, yeah, he got us. Yeah.
Joe Brady, you already talked about him. Offensive quarter coordinated for the Bills. I like Joe Brady. Obviously the Bills offense has been one of the best offenses in the league for a few years straight now. So whether or not that's, that's Josh Allen and the weapons that they have over there, that's, that's. Joe Brady is yet to be seen. But Joe Brady, I mean they haven't really had a ton of receivers there. They had what's his name for a minute, but like they haven't really had a ton of receivers to go with Josh Allen. Right.
[00:54:08] Speaker B: So Ken Dorsey looks good there, too, though.
[00:54:12] Speaker A: Fair.
[00:54:12] Speaker E: Fair.
[00:54:12] Speaker A: That's a fair. That's a fair assessment.
And I thought he did it, though. I thought that their offense was stagnant when Ken. Ken Dorsey.
[00:54:20] Speaker C: I want to say they fired Ken Dorsey and then Joe Brady took over.
[00:54:23] Speaker A: And reinvigorated the offense.
[00:54:25] Speaker C: Reinvigorated offense.
[00:54:26] Speaker B: They've been in the, like, AFC Championship game every year for like, the last five years. So that's fair.
[00:54:31] Speaker A: That's fair. I've got Clint Kubiak in here, offensive coordinator. Seahawks. Seahawks look good. We need wide receiver help. Jackson Smith and Jig, but obviously he was a big name coming out anyways.
But there's another Ohio State guy sitting out there in the draft. You could take him early on, Carnell Tate, and make him look like a star as well. So I like that name.
Dan Pitcher. This is. This is one that most Browns fans should know because he's the offensive coordinator of the Bengals.
And here's the deal.
[00:55:00] Speaker B: We've.
[00:55:00] Speaker A: We've sat through a few years of Kevin Stefanski taking every quarterback known to man, making him look like shit.
You get the exact opposite with Dan Pitcher because he's taken. You know, Joe Burrow hasn't been the healthiest gu.
And obviously you have Joe Burrow and you've done well with Joe Burrow, but you also have had it. Was it Jake Browning or What is it?
[00:55:19] Speaker C: AJ McCarron?
[00:55:21] Speaker A: Don't know if he had AJ McCarron. Browning. What was the other one?
[00:55:26] Speaker B: Joe Flacco.
[00:55:27] Speaker A: Joe Flacco. But like, like, like you have guys that are nobodies that have. Have looked good in your offense, and it's the. It's the opposite of what we're used to. We're used to like, like, you know, it should be plug and play. You just put another quarterback in and you keep rolling to an extent.
And that's what he's done. That's not what we've done. So I was just an interesting prospect there. Andy knows the Bengals. We'll be able to all over them for the rest of forever.
And then my final one, John Gruden, I know that's probably not happening, but I just think it would be the headlines between him and Shador being would be wild.
And you just get to. I want them to put us on Hard Knocks if Jon Gruden comes back, because it's gonna be the most entertaining series anybody has ever watched in the history of tv.
[00:56:13] Speaker C: Plenty of Northeast Ohio connections.
[00:56:15] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, he's A Browns fan growing up. Jim, was it or not?
[00:56:20] Speaker C: Baldwin Wallace.
[00:56:21] Speaker A: Yeah. But Kelly was his name.
[00:56:26] Speaker B: Chip Kelly?
[00:56:26] Speaker A: No, the running back for the Browns.
Old running back for the Browns.
Anyways, his favorite player growing up.
[00:56:33] Speaker B: Oh.
[00:56:34] Speaker A: So yeah, a lot, a lot of ties to northeast Ohio.
[00:56:38] Speaker B: I wasn't listening to you. That's why I said Chip Kelly. I had no idea what you said.
It's fine.
Is that your list?
[00:56:45] Speaker A: Yeah, that's my list. You were tuned out the whole time? You didn't listen to a single.
[00:56:50] Speaker B: Just the last part. No, I was tuned out because I was. I was actually thinking that we have some overlap on our list. So I'll cover these first couple really quickly.
Robert Sala just you know, echo a lot of things you said.
[00:57:01] Speaker A: Well respected Leroy Kelly is Leroy Kelly.
[00:57:04] Speaker B: Leroy Kelly great Chip Kelly or Leroy Kelly? I don't know. They're all Kelly's. Kelly Kelly. She was hot.
Robert Sala well respected defensive mind, players coach, fiery guy, keeps receipts.
Just think he's a good fit for the town. He just, he feels like a guy that would fit in in Cleveland. Clint Kubiak OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR Seattle got Sam Darnold playing really good football right now. Jackson Smith and Jigba has been utilized immensely in that offense. So he definitely understands the value of top flight receiver and I think that would weigh heavy in the draft process.
And he's also done it with a washed up left for dead quarterback. Right. Like I know Sam Darnold had a good year last year but like this guy was pretty much written off as you know, he's, he's average at best. So to be able to navigate not.
[00:57:49] Speaker A: Having Seattle, man, they went from what Geno Smith reviving his career and then it dying again and then Sam Darnold in a career revival.
[00:57:58] Speaker B: Well but I think that's important because I think that that speaks to your ability to not have a, you know, quote unquote star quarterback but get the most out of him.
Which was what I've been kind of asking for all along. Like I don't need the first pick in the NFL draft. I need a quarterback that you're willing to build around.
And then also just the fact that he's Gary Kubiak sons. So like dude grew up around the sport, he knows ball. Good call, good solid coaching pedigree.
And then Jon Gruden wish list for sure.
But I would love to see Chucky come home, whip these boys into shape, knows quarterbacks and to your point, if nothing else it would be entertaining as hell at least if we're losing.
[00:58:37] Speaker A: It's going to be really fun.
[00:58:39] Speaker B: Yeah. And so those are the ones we've.
[00:58:41] Speaker A: Had losing that hasn't been fun. Let's. Let's have some fun losing.
[00:58:45] Speaker B: Those are the ones that I have as overlap on our list.
My next, you know, couple here I just think are interesting. I think Jim Schwartz. I would at least interview Jim Schwartz because he doesn't represent a full reset, but he's enough of a change to shake things up and you know, you kind of keep that defensive core intact and a lot of what you're doing there and have him bring in who he thinks should run the offense.
Tommy Reese. I know people are hot and bothered by Tommy Reese. I don't know how close his ties really are with Stefanski and if he would be willing to say like, hey, see you later, coach. Like it's my gig now, if there's.
[00:59:24] Speaker A: Any ties, I don't want him anywhere near this offense.
[00:59:26] Speaker B: I truthfully haven't been that impressed with him to this point, but he is running Kevin Stefanski's scheme, so I don't hate the idea of giving him a shot. Sands Kevin Stefanski and he's another option that doesn't represent a full reset.
[00:59:41] Speaker A: By all accounts, he's, he's one of those up and comers. It's like a, like a rock star. There's a lot of younger guy in the football that are high on this.
[00:59:48] Speaker B: Guy and he's a Saban guy, so that's a pedigree I respect for sure.
And he's a guy that probably being an offensive guy and being young would likely be amenable to keeping a Jim Schwartz around because he doesn't know what he doesn't know and that's defense.
So to me that's at least an intriguing option.
And in this last one, people probably won't like this, but Deion Sanders, Greg Williams, you know, I'm open to bringing him back in.
[01:00:20] Speaker A: Old bounty Gate himself.
[01:00:22] Speaker B: I know he's been up and down as a coach, especially a head coach. He didn't have a lot of success in Buffalo, but that was 20 years ago. I think you live and learn. He's seen a lot of ball since then. He's 67 years old. He's been in Cleveland, so he knows what the turmoil looks like here. And I think a second pass at navigating those waters like I think he would do a better job as and he's a guy that knows how to put a staff together. I think he would bring some wisdom and Some vision as to what he would look like in what he would want in his kind of last go around as a head coach. I think that there's. There's value in that experience to know, hey, look, I've made a lot of mistakes. If I had a chance to do it all over again, here's the direction I would go. And he's a fiery guy. He's a. He's a player's coach. He's the guy that's going to rip assholes when stuff's not right.
[01:01:13] Speaker E: Dang.
[01:01:14] Speaker B: So, you know, I don't. I don't hate the idea. And then my final wish list would be Coach Prime. I am fully on board bringing Deion Sanders.
[01:01:22] Speaker A: Hashtag nepotism.
[01:01:23] Speaker B: Hashtag nepotism. I'm all for the quarterback head coach chemistry.
It's similar to Gruden. Would be entertaining as hell to have him here.
[01:01:32] Speaker A: The most entertaining thing about that would be if he ever had to bench his.
[01:01:36] Speaker B: Well, yeah, I mean, it brings a lot of interesting storylines into play for sure, but.
But I guess all this to say, like, there's a list of a million guides you could probably name off and they'd all be better than Kevin Stefanski at this point. I think Kevin Stefanski is. Is used to damaged goods at this point. I don't think there's any way you can repair the damage that's been done here.
And there's very little that he could do, if anything, outside of maybe winning the super bowl next year, that would make me go, that's a guy. That's a good NFL coach.
[01:02:06] Speaker C: Coach, I just want to say I've heard the argument on, like, whatever regular sports radio recently where people are like, well, who. Who else are you gonna get? Kevin Stefanski is the. Is the hands down favorite for any other coaching job in the NFL. And it's just like you do one little quick search. It's like there's a lot of people out there.
[01:02:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:02:26] Speaker C: You know, a lot of qualified individuals.
[01:02:28] Speaker B: There's a lot of defensive coordinators that are getting looks right now for head coaching gigs. There's even guys in the college ranks.
[01:02:33] Speaker A: That here's something that I'll throw out there. The argument that I keep hearing is, is that most people around the League understand the DeSean Watson mess. The Cleveland Browns, just the Cleveland Browns in general, like this. They don't put a lot of this on Kevin Stefanski, and they think that he's a better coach than what he's shown here. Well, go ahead, take him, because you're going to find out real quick. Yeah, his offense is shit. You're not going to move the ball, and in two years, you're going to be begging to have another coach.
[01:03:00] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. I mean, look, we've been through all the permutations on this, right? He made Baker Mayfield look bad. He made desean Watson unemployable.
And some of that was desean's fault.
[01:03:09] Speaker A: But Joe Flacco came in and found lightning in a bottle, and Kevin Svansky brought him back a couple years later and promptly smashed that bottle.
[01:03:18] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:03:18] Speaker B: I mean, when you think about the Joe Flacco experience the first time around, he had no time to prepare. He didn't know the playbook. He didn't know the system. It was street ball. Right. He was going out and just slinging it. This time around, I don't know.
[01:03:28] Speaker A: That guy looks open.
[01:03:29] Speaker B: This time around, he was a part of the offensive install. He was a part of training camp and everything.
[01:03:34] Speaker A: Ruined it.
[01:03:35] Speaker B: And he came out and looked like gas. He immediately went to Cincinnati and started throw over 300 yards.
[01:03:39] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:03:40] Speaker B: I mean, you can't tell me that Kevin Stefanski was responsible at all for the limited amount of success that we had here with Joe Flacco a couple.
[01:03:47] Speaker A: Of years ago and then turn around and say that he's not to blame for his downfall.
[01:03:51] Speaker B: Yeah, 100%.
So, yeah. I think in the other thing I keep hearing too is like, you know, Cleveland is such a dumpster fire and people are going to have to deal with the deshaun Watson contract. And now you have these two rookie quarterbacks. And you know that it's like a job that people wouldn't want. Like, who's going to come to Cleveland? Guys, that job is one of 32, and it pays $7 million a year. There are a hundred guys that would put their hands up to be the head coach of an NFL franchise. A million guys that would put their hands up to be the head coach of an NFL franchise. And it's not just no name, like low level college coaches, that would be like, well, I give it a shot. Like, there's legitimate coaches out there that would jump at the chance to be a head coach again or to be a head coach for the first time, to make that salary and to lead a program and have a chance to redefine their own destiny. You come to Cleveland and win, it's just like the LeBron thing, right? Like, you win here, you win here. You are immortal forever. You will never buy another beer in this town. Jesus. We've had Josh Cribbs on the show who's talked about fans literally buying him gasoline.
[01:05:00] Speaker A: Like, he's like, I'm Josh Cribs. I can pay for my own gas.
[01:05:04] Speaker B: My own gas.
[01:05:04] Speaker A: And that's, that's just, I mean, no disrespect to Josh Cribs. That's just Josh Cribs. Like, yeah, we didn't win when he was here.
[01:05:11] Speaker F: Right.
[01:05:11] Speaker B: I mean, Josh Cribbs was a special teams legend.
[01:05:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Hall of Famer, in my opinion.
[01:05:16] Speaker B: I mean, if you come here and win a Super bowl, forget it. You are immortalized in, in sports fandom forever.
[01:05:23] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:05:23] Speaker B: And our bar is so low, you don't even have to win a Super Bowl.
[01:05:27] Speaker A: Let's make the playoffs a couple times.
[01:05:28] Speaker B: If you came here and you were Philadelphia Andy Reid and you were in the AFC Championship game a couple of years, I am in immortal forever. You don't even gotta win the whole damn thing.
[01:05:38] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. With that, though, that's, that's our short list.
We'll get into more coaching talk as the season ends. We're gonna do a long list and Kevin Stefanski is fired. That's when we'll really start talking about it. But for now, let's go ahead. And we're gonna do another edition of Foreign Relations with Kenny Matt Neck.
[01:06:02] Speaker B: Powered by Riverside fm.
[01:06:10] Speaker A: Yep, that's right. Another edition of Foreign Relations. Joining us now is our first guest on of tonight's show from Canada. The first guest. We got another one coming.
[01:06:19] Speaker B: Another one from Canada.
[01:06:20] Speaker A: Yeah, another one from Canada. It's Canadian night.
[01:06:22] Speaker B: So much Canada.
[01:06:24] Speaker A: But this is our first one. It's Kenny, Matt, guys.
Kenny, how are you? Thanks for joining us.
[01:06:34] Speaker D: Hey, man, I couldn't be happier that that game yesterday is done and we only have three games left to put up with whatever we saw yesterday, man, so let's just get on with it.
[01:06:46] Speaker B: We're counting them down.
[01:06:46] Speaker A: Yeah, Sunday, Sunday's game was rough.
So, you know, we're bringing you on. We, we like to have you on the show every so often, Kenny, because you just, you bring such great insight. You got a lot of knowledge surrounding the Brown.
You, you moonlight for other podcasts as well. So you just, you're well spoken and.
[01:07:04] Speaker B: You'Re the president of presidents.
[01:07:05] Speaker A: You're the, you are the president of presidents.
[01:07:07] Speaker D: This. This year? Yeah, my term ends this year, so I will be kind of like a Stewart next year. But just quickly, there's a leadership council that looks over Browns backers worldwide, and I am the guy this year that does it? I've had such a blast meeting Browns fans. I met you guys like it's, it's a great time. It's reason why I watch Browns game still for the Browns fans to hang out with them, have a couple pints with them.
[01:07:30] Speaker B: That's right. You.
[01:07:31] Speaker A: So, so how does that work after you like are you. You now charge appearance fees and book.
[01:07:38] Speaker B: Deal in the works?
[01:07:39] Speaker D: Yeah, I got like, you know, tens of tens of fans.
[01:07:44] Speaker B: Oh, we know you got a lot more fans than that, Kenny Mac, you'll.
[01:07:48] Speaker A: Still keep up all your connections though, within, within the brownsbaggers organization, right?
[01:07:53] Speaker D: Absolutely, man. And you're always making more. You're running into new people, new like newer ex players. For me, like, I got to hang out with Eric Medcalf up Vegas when I was down for the Vegas game and that was super awesome. And I got to hang out with Gary Barnage as well. He's a super cool dude. Wore one of our T shirts for us. Great guys.
[01:08:14] Speaker A: We like Gary. Gary's. Gary's a funny guy.
[01:08:16] Speaker B: Gary's a trip.
[01:08:18] Speaker A: All right, so let's, let's go ahead and get into things here, Kenny. Obviously the focus the rest of the season is evaluating Shador and determining what we're going to do with our head coach.
So let's start with Shadow.
What are your thoughts so far on Shador Sanders?
[01:08:34] Speaker D: Well, I mean, if you take a look at yesterday's game, I'll be really quick on that. You can not evaluate any quarterback in that situation. Basically, if you guys would have seen there's a post about dvoa, it's defense adjusted value, value over average. Basically, what it's. What this sign tells you is they had the 11th worst single game since 1978.
So their total DVOA was negative 130.3%. So that means they had an offensive success rate of 8%.
So it was so historically bad. It basically means like this is what this tells you for this game yesterday. The pass protection was collapsing, the routes weren't winning, the run game wasn't viable.
Situational football was completely broken down. Did that sound like yesterday's game?
[01:09:32] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.
[01:09:33] Speaker D: And you know, The Browns have two more positions in that top 10, and that was the 1990 and the 2000 Cleveland Browns. And that was some awful football to watch.
So if you are Joe Burrow, if you're Patrick Mahomes, if you're Josh Allen, guess what, you're not winning that game. And it is 100% not your fault. And, and so I'M going to wipe that game out. When I saw him come in against the Ravens, he looked exactly like the way he left that Rams game when he was in with all the backups. Just, you know, soul crushing sacks. Just awful. But you could tell he wasn't prepared. Then he gets one week under him and I was down there for the, for the Las Vegas game.
He gets a week under him. He looks a little bit better.
And he basically was hitting short passes and long passes. Not the greatest, you know, what do you call it? Completion percentage. But you know, he did enough not to lose that game. Then he came out, you know, against San Fran. I don't know if you know is like, I mean he didn't have a great passing yards but you started to see him step in the pocket.
[01:10:48] Speaker A: Yep.
[01:10:48] Speaker D: You started to see him hit the intermediate passes because he wasn't doing that. And then he again, the offensive line is just failing him. Play a little bit of hero ball against Tennessee. But again then he used his legs. He was using his legs in college. He was running. He. When he put the team on him against the Titans. If it wasn't for these stupid. I don't know why you don't kick the point after.
[01:11:14] Speaker A: But anyways, we'll get to Kevin Stefanski soon enough. You just give me just a minute.
[01:11:19] Speaker D: Did enough to win that game. For some reason the defense didn't show up.
We made Jeffrey Simmons look like the best defensive tackle in the entire league for that, that game.
[01:11:30] Speaker A: Nobody knows his name unless they're playing the Browns.
[01:11:33] Speaker D: Then all of a sudden he's absolutely man. But the thing what I'm saying is like he's making adjustments to make his game better now. You know, one of the biggest signs or feedback that you get from people online, they're like, well he crushed it against of Vegas and Tennessee and they suck. Guess what? That's what other quarter rookie quarterbacks do too. They, they, they beat the competition that they can, you know, and I think you give him more of an addition and you give him some better weapons because when I got back to how bad that game was on Sunday, if you have no line and no receivers, how the hell are you going to develop any quarterback?
[01:12:15] Speaker F: Yeah.
[01:12:15] Speaker D: You know, so the one thing that he does and you can put the stats against Dillons is he will throw the ball down the field. That's all I've asked for because I know how bad this team is.
[01:12:26] Speaker E: Yeah.
[01:12:27] Speaker D: So he's, he's doing what I want. Now let's try and get him some Receivers in a line. Maybe it'll be slightly better this week because some of the line will return. But I mean, I don't know what's going to happen this week yet, but I'm all in favor, man, just let him keep tossing and let him develop.
And I think he's making small incremental steps. Be nice if he would have got a preseason.
[01:12:48] Speaker A: Yep. So you're, you're kind of heading that way anyways. It's good segue to leave it off there.
Do you think with the progression that he's had and how he's coming along and the fact that he didn't have an off season like Dylan did to, to prepare and learn the offense and all that's, you know. Do you. From what you've seen so far, do you think he could be the franchise quarterback for the Cleveland Browns?
[01:13:15] Speaker D: I think he, I think he's shown enough with the passes down the field and he's taking feedback from failures in previous games and applying it the following week. So I do. Based on what I'm seeing. I like what I see. He's like, when you can make a, an adjustment when you're taking soul crippling sacks, then you're staying in the pocket and you got to remind yourself you're staying in the pocket with Jenkins, Casey, Levinson, these guys are grading out with like 30 grades out of 100 on PFF. Like, you know, you're going to get smoked. And this guy's still standing in the pocket and getting his bell rung and he's still delivering a decent ball.
Now, am I saying he doesn't make mistakes? No, I'm not saying that. Am I saying he's miss. Doesn't miss reads? No, he's missing reads. But for the most part I think he makes. Makes intelligent enough decisions and I would like to see the decisions that he can make with a way better line and receivers that can separate because right now, Bond, Larva, Dane.
I don't know what Judy's doing. I don't even want to talk about that guy. You know what I mean? They. They can't do it. And you saw that he was playing hero ball at the end because he knew the only guy that could get separation, get the ball was Harold Fannin Jr. Yeah. Throwing 14, 14 passes his way, you know, because he was basically just Seward from the get go.
[01:14:41] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:14:42] Speaker B: Yeah. I think that's the thing that stands out to me is the, the week over week progress like he is. He is coachable and he is working to to better himself, which I think that you. You can work with anybody that is. Is able to. To make those kinds of adjustments week to week. You know, what does he look like after a full offseason, a full training camp?
Do you think, though, that he can do enough over the next couple of weeks with the body of work that he does have out there to keep this front office? And I guess we don't even know if it's going to be this front office, but to keep the Browns front office from going quarterback early in this draft.
[01:15:15] Speaker D: I think he can. But I also think, like, the money you have invested into Sean Watson is going to dictate some kind of decision, and that's the decision that we don't know. I'm not necessarily saying that, like, desean will play play, but what I'm saying is if you still have that, all that money invested in, he's going to be on the team if he's not injured. Right. And if he's on the team, you need an affordable option, you know, like Brock Purdy that can kind of gunsling a little bit, hit some intermediate. He throws a great screen game and he throws a great ball to the flats, which you kind of need. Right. So maybe you're keeping that quarterback at that favorable price.
I think that's what may dictate it a little bit, unfortunately, because we can't get this guy off the books until 2027.
[01:16:03] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:16:05] Speaker B: Yeah. That one's not going away.
[01:16:07] Speaker D: Yeah.
Did you just open your lump of coal?
I did about three weeks ago when that got reported and I was like.
[01:16:17] Speaker A: Oh, man, I had to erase our board. It was at 10 days since we've talked about Deshaun Watson, and now it's back down to zero.
So.
[01:16:25] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, it's hard not to when you got to make that quarterback decision. Right.
[01:16:29] Speaker A: So. Yeah.
[01:16:30] Speaker D: And, you know, tough.
[01:16:33] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:16:34] Speaker B: Well, let's talk about Kevin Stefanski.
[01:16:38] Speaker A: I don't want to go any further down the quarterback road at this point. Yeah, let's talk about Kevin Stefanski. So here's the deal. I. I think he's gone. Whether or not it's during the season is. Is a different story. But at the end of the season, I think Kevin Stefanski is gone. Kevin kenny, our boy, Mr. Thunder over here, does not. He thinks he comes back, so we'll start there. Do you think he will still be the coach next year of the Cleveland Browns?
[01:17:01] Speaker D: I'm thinking about those stats that I just gave you about the 130 -130.3%. And I think that was the final nail in the coffin, because I think Jimmy will be a man of his word, and he will say, 3 and 14 is not good enough, and that will be his demise. Whether Barry's gone or not. I'm still not sure on that one. But, I mean, if you look at the way that team performed, sure, it was cold out, getting paid millions of dollars to play that game. They looked uninspired, they looked unemotional. And the only guy that was trying out there was Shador.
Sorry, guys. The only guys that were trying out there was shador Schinger Fannin Jr.
Who also. I miss my Miles.
[01:17:49] Speaker A: Miles Garrett.
[01:17:50] Speaker D: And that.
[01:17:51] Speaker A: That's. That's all.
[01:17:52] Speaker D: I think he was really playing, like. Because, I mean, even if you're junkins, like, I love him, but he's getting smashed two yards behind the line of scrimmage. There's no. There's no reason for him to be there. Like, why even bother calling a passport or a run play? My bad. Run play.
[01:18:06] Speaker B: You know, do you put any stock in a defense for Kevin Stefanski being. Hey, this is kind of what Andrew has saddled me with. I mean, any chances Stefanski survives and Barry's got gone.
[01:18:19] Speaker D: I. I'll be honest with you. If I was Kevin Saanski would have left the team last year after this. This jamming of Ken Dorsey down my throat was. I felt like it kind of was and like I'd be tired of the team.
[01:18:30] Speaker A: So.
[01:18:31] Speaker D: I mean, you've heard whispers about him possibly being traded to the Giants, and I think. I'm not saying that's valid. These are all Internet rumors. Guys. Like, they're not anything that I believe. But I'm not saying I would disbelieve that he would want out because he looks. He looks unemotionless.
[01:18:46] Speaker E: I.
[01:18:46] Speaker D: On the sideline.
[01:18:47] Speaker A: Is that different from any other time that he's been seen him?
[01:18:50] Speaker D: Yeah, you know what? There's a little bit. He's. He is very stoic, I will say that, but he does not look engaged.
[01:18:57] Speaker A: Stoic is a very nice way of putting it.
Yes, yes, I know. You're the Browns. You're the president of presidents. You have to be PC on this topic. But let's. Let's be real. Kevin Stefanski has shown no emotion since he's been in Cleveland. It's part of the reason why we've been calling for. For his job. I understand he's 12 coach of the years, but we've been calling for his job since the second season. He here because the, the offensive schemes that he throws out there are just asinine.
Sorry. I got fired up a little bit because you had to be nice to Kevin Stefanski and I don't like that.
[01:19:29] Speaker B: Stefanski aside. So let's, let's play this out a little bit. If, if Kevin does go, whether he's traded or whether he's fired, whatever the case is, do you have a short list of guys you'd like to see in Cleveland?
[01:19:40] Speaker D: Yeah, man. That I find that such a tough one to see who's available because I mean, ultimately you'd want to make the transition to smooth and you'd want to maybe do like Clint Kubiak. You may want to do.
What do you call it?
[01:19:56] Speaker E: Who was it?
[01:19:57] Speaker D: Who's our old O line coach?
[01:19:59] Speaker A: Callahan.
[01:20:00] Speaker B: Callahan.
[01:20:01] Speaker D: You get the Callahan's to come in? Yeah, and that might be my short list because, I mean, I don't think you're going to draw anybody that's a big name or you may get a guy that has been around the league for a little bit. You like a Jon GRUDEN Or a McCarthy. And I'm not saying I want these guys. Guys, these are, these are lists of guys that I think that might take the job because they've either been here, done that, it might be a smooth transition, or they just have big enough cojones to like put up with the Deshaun Watson crap.
[01:20:34] Speaker A: Yeah. And that.
[01:20:35] Speaker D: That's it, you know, and they'll. They'll coach the team. Barry will do his thing without Deep podesta. Right. But if I had to like pound my fist for somebody right now, I don't really know because I mean, when I go on other podcasts, I still say, well, who's going to be better than Stefanski? He's got his hands and improvements from. With Shador, you know, So I mean, what I'm saying is like, I just think the Browns are stuck with him.
[01:21:03] Speaker A: Let's talk about that for a second. Kenny, you just opened up a can here because you said Stefanski has his hands in the development of Shador Sanders. Do you truly believe that?
[01:21:14] Speaker D: Well, he's going to get credit for.
[01:21:15] Speaker A: It because I know the reports came out this past week of.
Yeah, because. Because MKC says whatever the Browns tell her to say, and I'm pretty sure there's something going on with her and Kevin. But that's all speculation on my part.
[01:21:29] Speaker B: Allegedly.
[01:21:30] Speaker A: That's all speculation on my part. But just the way that she portrays him in the media is wild and I just don't buy. Think of the quarterbacks that have been here, all like 75 of them since Kevin Stefanski has been the coach. And what. What quarterback out of those was better because of Kevin Stefanski? I can't name any of them.
[01:21:54] Speaker D: You know what? I think he got like kind of a count your blessings with Flacco, and it made him look good.
He's good. He's the head coach. He's overseeing something. I'm sure our quarterback coach is. Got his reigns on him. I mean, he was buddies with Dion when he used to play. I think he understands the Sanders family.
And I mean, hey, like, why don't you do a couple things that Sanders did well when he was at Colorado? And it looks like that's happening. So maybe it's Reese, maybe it's Stefanski, maybe it's our QB coach, who knows? But he will get some of those, I guess some clout for basically being the head coach. But it goes back to what I originally said.
Jimmy Haslam said three wins isn't going to cut it. And I believe that Jimmy Haslam's not going to go back on his words on it. And they need a new. They need a new start. It can't just. Jimmy's sitting there watching the same crap that we are. It's his team. He can't be going, oh, I'm so into this right now.
The rest of the. Of us, you know.
[01:23:02] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, at this point, it's got to be embarrassing every time. Like his, you know, his. His elite friends are asking, like, talk to him about the clue. He's like, yeah, I own them.
[01:23:11] Speaker B: Yeah, they're a joke, right?
What if he, me and Genie's this thing? What if he pulls out a win against Buffalo or Pittsburgh or Cincinnati down the stretch?
[01:23:19] Speaker D: Like, if he, like if he wins out.
[01:23:21] Speaker B: Well, if you win. What if it was you win two of the last three here against teams that are. Well, since I was kind of off. But they're better teams than the birthday rounds.
[01:23:30] Speaker D: Their offense is certainly better. I mean, why you take our defense and their offense and we'd have a super team.
[01:23:36] Speaker B: They have a real football team.
[01:23:37] Speaker A: Yeah, let's combine teams in Ohio, you.
[01:23:41] Speaker D: Know, but, yeah, I mean, I don't see it, like, if he literally wins out the next three, like, maybe, but I just don't see this team going in a great direction. And I mean, before we had the 2023 season, I put an episode together for a podc and I said, you know, we got Schwartz. He's on the uprise. They've got this assistant head coach in Bubba Vetron. I couldn't been more wrong about that. He's going to shore up the special teams. The only guy that's on a decline is the guy that calls the offense.
And it's. It was Kevin Stefanski. And that season wasn't going that great. It could have been another 8, 9 season, but we got Joe Flacco to win it out for us and. And look where we are now. Another. We're staring in the crosshairs of another 3 and 14 season. And again, I'll get back to it. Jimmy said it's not good enough at three wins. One cut it.
[01:24:32] Speaker A: Yep.
Go ahead.
[01:24:34] Speaker B: I was gonna say, I mean, do you think there's any chance that maybe Jim Schwartz gets a look or even a Tommy Reese if Kevin does get the boot just to kind of maintain some kind of con. Consistent stability and either one of those guys, you think they're. They're viable at all, or you think if Kevin goes that it's just full reset.
[01:24:54] Speaker D: I think you go for a full reset. Cause I don't think. I don't think Schwartz wants it. I don't think. I think he likes being a defensive coordinator. I mean, he might be. Someone might get along with Jon Gruden. They're both fiery guys, so I can see them snapping each other every practice. You know what I mean?
But Jim Schwartz is an interesting candidate to me because I grew up so close to Detroit and a lot of my buddies are Lions fans. And one thing, when he was the head coach, they hated him and just couldn't manage a game. Right. He couldn't do a lot with the offense. If he was going to be your defensive.
[01:25:30] Speaker E: Sorry.
[01:25:30] Speaker D: If he's going to be your head coach, you're going to have to get a guy to run the defense that would take him away from that. Which may not be bad based on what we've seen in the last couple weeks against the run, but.
But you'd have to get an established offensive coordinator that he. That he has no say into anything and he just runs the offense on his own. And it's almost like two separate entities. Like he's just the CEO guy makes the final call, but that the offensive guys got most of all the call on, like calling the plays, you know. And that's what I want to see.
[01:26:05] Speaker A: One, one more just scenario with Jim Schwarz, one that I've talked about. And I know he didn't have a lot of success with the jets, but Robert Salah potentially coming in here and, and keeping Jim Schwartz as the defensive coordinator and he got kind of a defensive hard nose minded football team. I mean you got any thoughts on that?
[01:26:26] Speaker D: If you.
The problem with defensive coordinators is I feel like they're going to all have want a coordinator like Tommy Reese. When Tommy Reese was at Notre Dame, what do you do? He ran on first down. So you get 1, 2 yards. Guess what you're doing on second down. You're running on second down. Then you're going to do play action. It's going to be this intermediate stuff. Might be a screen game. They don't call games like we just saw from Ben Johnson. Ben Johnson, man, if you could get a coordinator like that, and I haven't done my research to say who might be close, there's anybody we can get close to that. That team was buttoned up, they were locked in and then the def. Was, was kind of mid for, you know, the Bears, they were locked in because the offense was doing well. They just broke our spirit with a run and that's what, that's what I think you need now if you have Salah and you keep Schwartz and you have some kind of guy that you can get like that. So maybe Mike LaFleur. No, sorry, Matt LaFleur is what I meant to say. Mike's the Green Bay coach, but his brother, maybe he has some kind of thing in him where we could get him, him to, to button us up like that, like have that, that great running offense. He believes in some of the same principles that Stefanski does, but just probably more imaginative, you know.
[01:27:40] Speaker A: Yeah, my, my thought with Robert Salah has been that just the league adjust to defenses and the Browns have had an upper level defense for a few years now and so if you bring in Salah maybe they can kind of mix some of their schemes a little bit to keep it to, to keep it fresh and to keep other teams guessing would be my thought there.
[01:28:02] Speaker D: But I would seriously have to say what he learned from his failures in, in the jets and obviously they won't let me in that room to hear that.
[01:28:09] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't, I don't know.
[01:28:11] Speaker D: You know.
[01:28:13] Speaker B: Well, that was going to be my just final point is just around even Jim Schwartz I know, you know, wasn't popular the last time around he was a head coach. But there's something to be said I think for that experience and going through it and being part of, part of real adversity and, and that was what, 10, 15 years ago. I mean he's certainly matured. Seen a lot more ball since then. I just think there's something to be said about kind of your second go around and knowing where you misstep the first time and being able to avoid those mistakes in the future.
[01:28:42] Speaker D: Yeah, guys, look at, look at Bill Belichick when he was a Browns coach. Man, he was awful. He was like Stefanski. He would pull out. He would be Dallas four square scores. Sorry, two scores. He would go for a two point conversion. He tried doing Metcalf up the middle. He had Bernie Kozart running bootlegs. Like it just, it was just dumb stuff that he was doing. Like he was trying to find his bearings as an offensive coordinator and it just didn't work for the Browns, you know, and he liked playing volleyball. That's one thing I will.
You know, for Belichick, he did really well. He got the biggest offensive line. He won the run U over. Over Bully ball with Kevin Stefanski. Does not work. Like you guys all knew we were going to lose this game. We knew that this third rated offensive line was just going to ram it down our throat because we've seen it every single time in a cold game. We saw Jon Gruden do it to us with Jacobs.
We've seen what's his name, Dennis Allen, do it with Kamara when it was like minus 24 here and there was bursting water mains all over Cleveland Stadium.
We just got our asses kicked. And then they did it again to us last year where they had.
What's the quarterback, tight ends guy's name Tyson?
[01:29:58] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:29:58] Speaker D: From New Orleans.
[01:29:59] Speaker A: Yep.
[01:30:00] Speaker D: He, he, he put like 224 yards. It was an embarrassment.
[01:30:04] Speaker A: We were there.
You know, it was bad.
[01:30:06] Speaker B: That's right.
[01:30:07] Speaker D: You guys were there.
[01:30:08] Speaker A: Yeah, we were there.
It was one of the worst things I've ever seen.
A couple, a couple very last, last minute points here because we do got to wrap this up, unfortunately. We wish we could talk to you all night, Ken.
One bully ball with Kevin Stefanski. Looks like the tight end taking a snap from the backup quarterback or the backup center and trying to get 1 yard on 4th and 1 in our own territory.
[01:30:30] Speaker D: Works for the Ravens and he goes for 60 yards.
[01:30:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
[01:30:35] Speaker B: Known that was coming after that.
[01:30:36] Speaker A: And then my other point is just this.
I just want to welcome you and everybody else.
I believe that you were optimistic. I'll call it on Kevin Stefanski for a long time. I think a lot of people, people were.
But I just want to welcome you. I want to welcome everybody to the party. Like I said, we've been calling for his job for four years. We got called crazy for multiple years. Now everybody's here with us, and we. We love it. We love that you guys have seen the light and understand that Kevin Stefanski's offensive scheme is absolute garbage and that we need somebody in here that can just do more than tell everybody that it's his fault and he's gonna do better and he will do better, and he's to get it right. He won't.
So. Welcome.
[01:31:19] Speaker D: That's a tough. Listen, like, I mean, my girlfriend watches the Browns and she likes football, and when she hears that, she. It just drives her crazy.
[01:31:27] Speaker A: Yeah.
Yep.
[01:31:28] Speaker B: Kenny, I got one final quick question for you.
Any chance of a Bill Belichick Cleveland reunion with things not going well in. In North Carolina or. Or will the girlfriend have the final say there?
[01:31:42] Speaker D: Yeah, I don't. She doesn't look like a Cleveland girl, so I don't know about that. Yeah, it'll be like. It'll be like, what is it, not Training Day? The NFL one where my. I brought my wife from Dallas, you know, nice, fancy Dallas. And now we're living in Cleveland, you know, like Dennis Leary's character.
I feel like that's what it would be. But, you know, Bill may do what he wants to do, but I wouldn't rule anything out at this point, you know?
[01:32:09] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, Kenny, thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate it. Again, I wish we could sit here and talk with you all night. It's always a fun time when you're on the show.
You have your own segment and you. You're on far. We don't use it nearly enough, so we'll make sure that before the end of the season, before we officially wrap up for season four, we'll have you back in one more time for foreign relations with Kenny Mack. Right on.
[01:32:33] Speaker D: I'll have to give you a call. When I'm from the game, I'll.
[01:32:35] Speaker F: I'll be.
[01:32:36] Speaker D: Be. I'll be celebrating. Miles, second sack. I'm putting it out in the universe, man. I know.
[01:32:41] Speaker C: That's.
[01:32:41] Speaker A: Call the hot take hotline.
[01:32:43] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:32:43] Speaker B: Manifest that hot take hotline.
[01:32:44] Speaker D: That's what I'm gonna do, man.
[01:32:46] Speaker A: Absolutely. Kenny Mack, thank you so much.
[01:32:49] Speaker D: Right on.
[01:33:00] Speaker A: Good having Kenny Mac on again. We don't have him on often enough, honestly. He's got great insight.
[01:33:05] Speaker B: Kenny Mack is my favorite Canadian next to Terrence and Phillip.
[01:33:09] Speaker A: You're going to talk to another one here in a little bit, and he's going to be Upset that you think Kenny Mack is better than he is.
[01:33:13] Speaker B: Well, maybe after I talk to him, he'll be my new favorite Canadian. But Kenny Mack always. Kenny Mack always brings the heat. That's a guy that's plugged in on all sides of the ball. Analytics coach speak. I mean, and he's got boots on the ground with. With the Browns, so hearing it from him carries some weight and some authority versus, you know, a lot of what you hear just on the interweb.
[01:33:36] Speaker A: Versus hearing it from us.
[01:33:38] Speaker B: Sure. Yeah.
Even though we've been right the whole time.
[01:33:41] Speaker A: Yeah, we're always right. We. I had to let him know that I was right.
[01:33:47] Speaker B: But we love having Kenny Mack on.
[01:33:48] Speaker A: I think I let him know twice, actually.
[01:33:50] Speaker B: But you're always. You always get contentious with Kenny Mack. I don't know why he keeps coming back on our show.
[01:33:55] Speaker A: It's just. It's just good band, you know, that's a British term for you.
[01:33:59] Speaker B: I think he has the ability to compartmentalize. He's been around Browns and Browns fans for so long. He knows that it all comes from a place of love for the team and just the desire to be better. And they screw the pooch on it every year, and we just get worse and worse and worse.
[01:34:15] Speaker A: Yep. But with that, let's go ahead and get into the division roundup.
All right, so we'll start with Cincinnati. Cincinnati lost the Ravens.
Everybody was wrong. Sever Bone. He was the only one that picked the Ravens. I don't know what we were thinking.
Like, I know Lamar Jackson's banged up and hasn't been good lately, but I just don't know what we were all thinking. We all picked against the Ravens in a game. Bengals versus Ravens.
Bengals are 4 and 10.
[01:34:50] Speaker B: I guess I just have a lot of faith in Joe Burrow. I. I don't know.
[01:34:53] Speaker C: You look good. Two weeks ago or a week ago, whatever it was.
[01:34:56] Speaker A: But Bone got this one right. You're the only one. So you Bone.
Next up, Pittsburgh is. They're playing the Dolphins as we speak, which, actually, we could go ahead and update this because the score is currently, what, 28 to 3?
[01:35:10] Speaker B: I think it is now the 9 or something.
[01:35:11] Speaker A: 28 to 9, whatever it is.
So Pittsburgh is going to beat Miami.
We were all right in this one. We all had Pittsburgh. We said Miami can't play in the corner cold, which clearly they have a hard time.
[01:35:24] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:35:24] Speaker A: So. And then finally, the Cleveland lost to the Bears.
Everybody was right on this one except for Kenny, who's in desperation mode at.
[01:35:31] Speaker B: This Point I'm making defensive picks.
[01:35:32] Speaker A: Yeah. So for the AFC north, the standings are as follows. Pittsburgh is on top at 8 and 6, Baltimore at 7 and 7, Cincinnati at 4 and 10, and then Cleveland at 3 and 11. And for King of the north, standings are current. Currently bone at 31 and 16.
John and I both sitting at 29 and 18, and Kenny trying so hard to get back to.500 at 21 and 26. We'll talk more about this in just a little bit.
[01:35:58] Speaker B: I know we don't give betting advice on this show, but if you picked with Bone, you'd be in the money.
[01:36:02] Speaker C: Bone's really good money.
[01:36:05] Speaker A: The best part is, I'm pretty sure Bones looks at. He's like, nah.
[01:36:08] Speaker C: And I don't go with.
[01:36:09] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:36:10] Speaker B: Most weeks, he says, they're at home. I'll go with them.
[01:36:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
It's probably not a bad strategy.
[01:36:16] Speaker B: Clearly a working one.
[01:36:17] Speaker A: Yeah. Let's take a quick trip around the NFL.
All right. We're going to start with Old Man River. Philip Rivers is so old. How old is he?
Philip Rivers is so old that he took over for Doug Fluty and threw his first NFL pass for a team that no longer exists in a stadium that no longer exists.
[01:36:44] Speaker B: And he was back. And he almost won.
[01:36:47] Speaker A: He almost won. He didn't, though.
[01:36:49] Speaker B: He didn't, though. He did have a. A pretty viral stumble in the backfield.
[01:36:54] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. He just, like, tripped. He was like, I'm old. Oh, down he goes.
[01:36:58] Speaker B: He looked like Old Man River.
[01:36:59] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:37:00] Speaker B: But for the most part, I, I, I, I find it fascinating that, you know, there's. There's a lot of college quarterbacks every year that, you know, go pro. And on some level or another, there's even veterans out there that, you know, either on practice squads or, you know, your Kenny Pickets of the world that are kind of journeymen and bumping around that. The Colts were in a place where they said, we're in the middle of a competitive season. We lost our starting quarterback. We got to find somebody.
[01:37:24] Speaker A: We need some wins to get in the playoffs.
[01:37:28] Speaker B: We'll need one or two wins to kind of solidify things, and we'll need that guy to then take us through the playoffs. And. And their best option was a guy that hasn't played football in five years who's a grandpa.
[01:37:38] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:37:40] Speaker B: They were like, there's a lot of active quarterbacks out there. We're not interested in any of those guys. We want. We want Philip Rivers here.
[01:37:45] Speaker A: Yeah. So what was it?
[01:37:46] Speaker C: The offensive coordinator had a relationship with him or something?
[01:37:49] Speaker B: Well, he played. That was where he kind of ended his career as an Indianapolis. So Shane Steichen and him, I guess, are tight and still talk. So they.
[01:37:57] Speaker A: I can only imagine that. Hey, hey, man, what are you doing?
[01:38:01] Speaker B: That's. That's pretty much what happened if you listen to the story. He was kind of like.
I mean, they, they, he, they. They called him and asked him what he had left, and he said, I have no idea, you tell me. And showed up and, and literally didn't have a pair of cleats. He took them out of his trophy case in his living room. And he was like, look, I gotta show my kids that, you know, when, when stuff happens, you just gotta roll with the punches and go, you know, anything's possible.
So he flew out to Indy and tried on his old cleats and he.
[01:38:29] Speaker A: Was like, he's still fit.
[01:38:30] Speaker B: Whatever.
[01:38:31] Speaker A: I'm up 40 pounds, but I can still play.
[01:38:33] Speaker C: It's a really, really good story.
[01:38:35] Speaker B: I mean, it would be something if, if they made some kind of playoff run with him at the helm.
You know, Philip Rivers is one of those guys that his time went on, became more and more likable, and had a great NFL career. I mean, it's probably hall of fame worthy. From a number stand, I would say. Yeah, no one ever really wanted.
[01:38:51] Speaker A: Maybe not first ballot, but he's definitely gonna be in there.
[01:38:52] Speaker B: He probably would get in, I mean, through for 60, 000 yards in his career. I mean, he's top 20 quarterbacks of all time, probably.
[01:38:59] Speaker A: That's probably more than the Browns franchise total standpoint.
[01:39:03] Speaker B: Yeah, that ain't no joke.
Our last MVP was Brian Sipe in 1980.
[01:39:08] Speaker A: Yeah, you, you mentioned all the people that could potentially play quarterback for somebody if they need him to. I'll tell you somebody who was not happy that Philip Rivers is out there, there, and that's Cam Newton. Cam Newton called it a slap in the face that he didn't even get a call.
[01:39:21] Speaker B: He was pissed. He said he still has a lot in the. In the tank.
I'll bet Colin Kaepernick was probably upset too.
[01:39:27] Speaker A: Probably. I, I think Cam Newton's the funnier one, though, because Cam Newton, like, ain't nobody want all your nonsense with all your hats.
Get the out of here.
[01:39:37] Speaker B: Beating up mascots.
[01:39:38] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. You literally tried to fight a mascot like nobody wants that.
[01:39:41] Speaker B: That's not mental tough.
[01:39:42] Speaker A: That's the only smoke you're getting nowadays.
[01:39:44] Speaker B: I do trust Philip Rivers to be more mentally tough than Cam. And Cam Newton Yeah.
[01:39:48] Speaker A: Next up here, there was a trainer spotted kicking Bears backup QB Case Keenum in the nuts in a photo of Caleb Williams warming up. I don't know if you saw this, but, like, Caleb Williams, like, the photo was literally of Caleb Williams. And I don't, I don't actually know what was going on with the trainer and Case Keenum, but basically Case Keenum's like, holding his foot with both hands, like, tucked up into his groin. And it's just, it just looks, looks like he wound up and gave him like the biggest kick to his nuts.
[01:40:15] Speaker B: I'm just excited that former Brown Case Keenum made the. Made the list this week of things to talk about.
[01:40:20] Speaker A: You're welcome. That was a story.
Next up, Dolphins haven't lost a game. Well, until tonight, the Dolphins hadn't lost a game since Tua said that he would like to play a game in Jerusalem. So the question was, are they favored by the. By God. And the answer is for a minute. Although they are about to come. It's. Oh, it's two point.
[01:40:40] Speaker B: They're trying to cut.
[01:40:41] Speaker A: Yeah, they're trying to cut it to two possessions. They didn't.
There's still two possessions.
[01:40:46] Speaker C: They're also eliminated from the playoffs after this loss.
[01:40:49] Speaker A: Yeah. So they are not favored by God, Kenny.
[01:40:51] Speaker B: I guess not. They were for a minute.
[01:40:53] Speaker A: I know that was your question.
[01:40:55] Speaker B: At the very least, God bought Mike McDaniels another season. Probably.
[01:40:58] Speaker A: Yeah, probably.
Next up, a bad week for ACLs in the NFL.
[01:41:02] Speaker B: It's a bad time to be an ACL.
[01:41:04] Speaker A: There's probably more than just this, but unless you want to terror. Micah Parsons and Patrick Mahomes were the two, two big names that went down with ACL chairs this week. So just feels really bad. Those are two really big names in the sport.
[01:41:14] Speaker B: So huge names. You know, obviously the, the Chiefs were kind of, I think, eliminated from playoff contention.
[01:41:20] Speaker A: Well, he went down, then they lost. Gardner Minshew tried to lead a comeback. Wasn't able to do it through an interception at the end of the game. And they were eliminated from playoffs.
[01:41:27] Speaker B: Yeah, and the Chiefs have had a. Had a tough year. All of a sudden I'm seeing like fire Andy Reid posts. I'm like, man, these people super bowl every year for like the last seven years. Like. And now your. Your coach isn no idea what the hell.
[01:41:42] Speaker A: It's kind of like the same shit he's getting. I mean, I know he didn't make it to the big game. He lost in the championship game a lot when he was with the Eagles but it's like the same shit. Like, it's. He's got to be saying, I'm having deja vu. Like, my team's phenomenal every year and they want to fire me.
[01:41:56] Speaker B: And I think the reality of this is, like you kind of talked about this earlier, like, it's hard to be number one for a really long time.
[01:42:03] Speaker A: And the Chiefs have been, especially in the NFL. It's. It's more so than any league. It's built for Paris.
[01:42:08] Speaker B: Yeah. And so they've had a absolutely dominant run, a couple super bowl victories. And that roster is aging. I mean, Patrick Mahomes is. Not that Patrick Mahomes is past his prime, but he's older now.
[01:42:21] Speaker A: He'll retire after the year.
[01:42:22] Speaker B: Travis Kelsey is older. I mean, some of the guys on that.
[01:42:24] Speaker A: He's about to get Taylor Swift pregnant and then he's going to have all kinds of stuff to do.
[01:42:28] Speaker B: Getting older. Yeah, he's about to be a grandpa. So is that how it works?
Yeah. Travis Kelsey's gonna be a grandpa.
[01:42:38] Speaker F: So.
[01:42:38] Speaker B: I don't know. I don't. I mean, I think the Chiefs probably have some runs left in them because they'll probably retool here. Look, if Patrick Mahomes has a torn ACL now, he very well may not be ready for the start of next season. They'll probably use next year as a reloading year to go out and get some talent, younger, younger guys around him. And, you know, I'd expect them in the next three to five years to still be very competitive football team.
[01:43:01] Speaker A: Yeah.
Some parallels with Mahomes and Tom Brady here. Patriots quarterback Tom Brady in NFL season eight going for his fourth ring, loses in the Super Bowl. Chiefs quarterback Patrick Mahomes and NFL Season 8, going for his fourth ring, loses in the Super Bowl.
The following year, Patriots quarterback Tom Brady in season nine injures his left knee and the team misses the playoffs.
Chiefs QB Patrick Mahomes and season nine injures his left knee and the team misses playoffs.
[01:43:30] Speaker B: So Lincoln was assassinated by Kennedy and Kennedy was assassinated by Marilyn Monroe.
[01:43:34] Speaker A: That's what I said.
Yeah, that's what I always say. Yeah. Just interesting stuff, especially with the fact that he's the only one that's even close to Tom Brady's pace is just wild.
[01:43:45] Speaker B: I mean, that's the kind of stuff that feeds into the. The NFL is the scripted. Like how does that even happen?
[01:43:52] Speaker A: Well, it's Joe Thysman and then Alex Smith on the same. The same yard marker, the same quarter down distance, like everything.
[01:44:00] Speaker B: What are the odds of these, these things happen.
[01:44:02] Speaker A: Astronomical.
But they happen.
[01:44:05] Speaker B: They do.
[01:44:06] Speaker E: They do.
[01:44:06] Speaker A: And real quick now for some college football news. Throwback to our new story of the week. A while back, the Tokyo toe Kenawa Matsuyama. Yeah. Who learned how to kick from YouTube videos and kicks for Hawaii is a finalist for the Lug Roa award.
[01:44:20] Speaker B: Yes. He went, I think 36 to 36 on extra.25 of 26 on 50 field goals.
[01:44:27] Speaker A: Just hasn't missed.
[01:44:28] Speaker B: Learned to kick while working at Morton Steakhouse.
[01:44:30] Speaker A: Good job, buddy.
[01:44:31] Speaker C: That's strong work right there.
[01:44:32] Speaker A: Yeah. And then finally got to be one.
[01:44:33] Speaker B: Of the best stories in college football this year.
[01:44:35] Speaker A: Yep. And then finally, congratulations to Fernando Mendoza on winning the Heisman. You won the Heisman being 24th in nation in passing yards. You've only had one game that's over 300 yards. You had a signature come from behind. Victory over 3 and 6 Penn State in a total of two significant throws against Ohio State to win that game. So quite the Heisman resume. Just absolutely phenomenal.
[01:44:58] Speaker B: I mean, it is just laughable to me that people are like, this guy, we want him first overall.
[01:45:03] Speaker A: Plus he's just the dweebiest dude.
I can't stand him. I just never like derp. Like, that's all I think when I see him is derp.
[01:45:10] Speaker B: I have never been less interested in a quarterback prospect than I am in him.
[01:45:14] Speaker A: Me neither. And I, I thought it was kind of disrespectful that Julian sand all only got eight first place votes, especially considering the. The running back, what's his name from Jeremiah Love. Jeremiah Love from Notre Dame finished second and he had less touchdowns than.
[01:45:29] Speaker B: Well, he finished third. He finished behind, finished in front of.
[01:45:31] Speaker A: Julian, Finished well ahead of Julian saying.
And he had less touchdowns and less rushing yards as a running back than Johnny Manziel. Yes, that Johnny Manzel quarterback Johnny Manzel did in 2012.
[01:45:43] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:45:44] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:45:44] Speaker B: I don't know that Julian Saint should have won the Heisman, but I'm not saying that eight 40 first place votes was disrespectful, especially if Jeremiah Love got 46 or 48. So I just, I don't know. I. What's going on in college football? Like Shador Sanders threw for over 4,000 yards a year ago.
[01:46:01] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:46:02] Speaker B: This is the best we have to offer.
[01:46:04] Speaker A: Yeah. But with that, Kenny, I think it's time for another interview.
[01:46:08] Speaker B: Oh, Canada.
How much money do you make a year before taxes?
[01:46:17] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm actually not comfortable answering that.
[01:46:19] Speaker B: Come on, we're doing the interview now.
[01:46:22] Speaker A: Not you all right, guys? So for this brownsbaggers interview, please help me welcome, hailing from Shock's billiard lounge in Toronto, Canada, the president of the Toronto Brownsbackers, Jim.
Jim, thank you so much for joining us. How are you today?
[01:46:41] Speaker E: I'm fantastic. How are you guys guys doing?
[01:46:43] Speaker A: Good. Good.
[01:46:44] Speaker B: Trying to stay warm here in this cold snack.
[01:46:46] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm doing about as good as I can with the Browns being as bad as they are, so.
[01:46:49] Speaker E: Oh, I hear that. I hear that.
[01:46:51] Speaker A: Yeah. But did I get the name of the. Your viewing location right? Is it Shocks?
[01:46:55] Speaker E: It is Shocks. That is correct. Shocks Billiard lounge in the heart of the junction in Toronto.
[01:47:01] Speaker A: Nice, nice. It's spelled in case anyone's wondering why I was asking it spelled.
[01:47:04] Speaker B: I was like, what is it written in Canadian?
[01:47:05] Speaker C: What?
[01:47:06] Speaker A: S, H, O, X, S is how it's spelled. So I was like, I think that shocks.
[01:47:10] Speaker B: That sounds Canadian.
[01:47:11] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:47:12] Speaker A: No offense to Canada. You know, we love Canada.
But Jim, listen, tell us about your chapter.
[01:47:19] Speaker E: Oh, absolutely.
So the Toronto Brown Spacker has been around since 2008, founded in large part by our former president Brian Loberg, who I know a lot of your listeners, particularly those who are members of the Browns packers worldwide community are familiar. Familiar with.
Brian was a member of the leadership council for years and an all around great guy. Very big on the Browns and unfortunately passed away a few years ago.
Then Matty Weeks took over as president and a lot of your listeners will be familiar with Matty. And then I took over from Matty. We have about 150 members in the club.
I would say in any given week we probably get a decent crowd of between. Anywhere between between 20 and 40 at shocks.
It's been closer to 20 most weeks this season for reasons I think everyone is familiar with.
[01:48:18] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
[01:48:20] Speaker E: But you know, we have a great time.
Shocks is a fantastic host for us.
We have a lot of fun watching the Browns together and we have a lot of fun supporting charity as well. Our main charity is the Brian and Lenny fund, named after Brian Loberg and Lenny Pino, who are two former members of ours who passed away early due to heart disease related issues. And Brian and Lenny fund is to raise money for heart and stroke.
We put a lot into it and in fact last year we raised over $9,000 for Heart and stroke.
[01:48:54] Speaker A: Nice.
[01:48:55] Speaker E: Which is something near and dear to our hearts for sure.
And then the other big charitable thing we do every year is a food and toy drive. We start around Canadian Thanksgiving.
We get as much food and toys together as we can and Then after our holiday party, which happened to be yesterday, we, we take everything that we've gathered together and we walk it over to the nearest fire hall.
It's literally a half a block from Shocks and you know, the firefighters are happy, happy to collect charitable donations on our behalf. And yeah, we, we raise a lot, both food and toys which I'm sure you can imagine are both in dire need this time of year. So.
[01:49:41] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. But I know Kenny Mac, we talked to him earlier in the show and he mentioned Canadian Thanksgiving as well. So I'll just reiterate that here. I'm not saying, you know, us Thanksgiving is better or anything, but us Thanksgiving is pretty cool.
[01:49:57] Speaker E: So U.S. thanksgiving is pretty, pretty awesome.
[01:50:02] Speaker B: Jim, Toronto's, you know, somewhat of a destination city. Do you get a lot of like outer out of towners traveling through for your. For your watch parties?
[01:50:10] Speaker E: I would say we get at least one, usually multiple out of towners every week. So. Which is always nice.
Yeah, our watch party, our, our bar is.
We're very lucky that shocks is a very generous host in terms of allowing us to keep up our paraphernalia, our brown gear, 365 days a year.
The back corner of the bar is brown and orange.
It is thoroughly Browns. And every out of towner who comes is always a bit aghast actually at just how Browns the space is.
[01:50:46] Speaker B: That's awesome.
[01:50:47] Speaker A: Are they so confused? They just look at it like what the hell happened here?
[01:50:52] Speaker E: Yeah, we had a Steelers fan come in a few weeks ago and he was just. I had no idea anything like this existed anywhere.
[01:51:00] Speaker B: So that's awesome.
[01:51:01] Speaker A: Steelers don't travel like that.
[01:51:03] Speaker B: Jim. I don't hear a whole lot of like French Canadian and you in your accent there. Are you a transplant and moved to Canada?
[01:51:10] Speaker E: I'm originally from rural eastern Ontario, so I'm a born and bred Canadian. I've lived in Toronto for about 30 years. But I would say for our membership, probably 2/3 homegrown and one third transplanted Clevelanders or Northeast Ohio and is the case, may be.
[01:51:30] Speaker B: So how did you end up a Browns fan?
[01:51:32] Speaker E: I grew up in the 80s. I grew up watching Bernie Kosar Webster slaughter, you know, the original dog Pound.
That team was fantastic.
And I also, I will admit that.
[01:51:46] Speaker A: I mean this team isn't.
It might not quite be the equal.
[01:51:51] Speaker E: Of the 80s team. Let's just say that.
[01:51:53] Speaker A: Nice. All right, all right, all right.
I digress.
[01:51:57] Speaker E: But yeah, I loved the sort of the underdog mentality that those 80s Browns teams had when they were playing against a certain team of orange donkeys from the western United States. But yeah, it was awesome. It was good times to be a Browns fan and maybe not such good times nowadays.
[01:52:17] Speaker A: Yeah, that's fair.
We use that thing from. From the office a lot. Is. I wish you knew the good times.
[01:52:23] Speaker B: When you were in them. Yeah.
[01:52:27] Speaker A: But let's not. No, it's awesome that you guys are doing so much charity work and everything.
I say this almost every time we do one of these interviews.
[01:52:36] Speaker B: And.
[01:52:36] Speaker A: And the president of the chapter that we're interviewing is able to throw out the numbers as far as you said about $9,000. Like, just extrapolate that. There's 300 and some Browns backers chapters times $9,000. That's the amount of charity work that the Browns back Packers Worldwide is doing.
And I know some are more, some are less, but we'll just say an average and, you know, it adds up. And you guys do a ton of work and it's. It's really awesome to see, especially around this time of the year.
It's just. It's just great that you guys are doing that. But let's go ahead and flip things over to the football side.
You know, why. Why we have this common ground here and why we all come together. The Cleveland Browns for the. For better, for worse.
But let's start with Shador Sanders. Obviously, it's a big talk right now with Cleveland Browns. What are your thoughts on Shador Sanders and do you think this is a guy that they can build around?
[01:53:30] Speaker E: So I will admit what I have seen from him so far on the field is better than I expected.
I think that he's definitely got some talent.
I think he's definitely got the right character, if you will, to. To. To be a starter in the NFL. And. And I would.
Without throwing anyone under the bus, I would be interested to see what he could do with a full year under his belt and perhaps different people around him. Let's just put it that way.
[01:54:06] Speaker A: I'll throw him under the bus. If we could just get rid of Kevin Stefanski and let this guy play.
Yeah, I think we. I think he'd be all right. Yeah, you don't worry about it. I got you.
[01:54:14] Speaker B: Speak freely here, Jeff.
[01:54:15] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. This is. We're among friends.
[01:54:18] Speaker E: I would love to. I would love to see Shador Sanders get a chance to perform under a different head coach, maybe a different offensive coordinator.
I. I'd also love to see him perhaps with an upgraded offensive line. He was running for his life yesterday and it wasn't a lot of fun to watch.
[01:54:35] Speaker A: Yeah, it was bad.
[01:54:37] Speaker E: You sort of feel like he's being, you know, thrown to the wolves a bit. And you know what, what could he do with some, with some decent protection?
[01:54:45] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. So.
[01:54:47] Speaker E: And a wide receiver that doesn't drop the ball.
[01:54:50] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a good call out.
[01:54:52] Speaker A: Yeah.
Do you think with him being on the roster, in the quarterback class, in our opinion at least, is not very strong coming into this next season? I know originally it was talked at. Talked about as one of the better quarterback classes in a long time. It's really fallen off since then. Would you stick with Shador and build a record around him or would you go with a quarterback? I know Mendoza is the, the hot name floating around at the top of the draft.
What would you do in the draft?
[01:55:20] Speaker E: Oh, well, let's just put it this way. I wouldn't rage flip a table if they drafted Mendoza, but it wouldn't be my choice. I would.
[01:55:26] Speaker A: Okay.
[01:55:27] Speaker E: I would like to see. I would like to see them build the offensive line in the wide receiver core out with some of those draft picks that they have and, and put some tools in place for a quarterback, whether it be Shadow or someone else down the road to be somebody successful. I don't think anyone they could draft this year could possibly be successful playing on. On this offense.
[01:55:46] Speaker A: Agreed.
[01:55:47] Speaker B: Yeah. Jim, you said you dropped that pretty nonchalantly. Do you rage flip a lot of tables?
[01:55:53] Speaker E: I'm a Brown fan. What do you think?
[01:55:55] Speaker A: Of course. Of course.
We, you know, we know an angry. Bobby. Are you angry, Jimmy?
[01:56:03] Speaker E: I might be angry.
[01:56:04] Speaker B: Jimmy.
[01:56:05] Speaker E: I might be angry Sunday afternoon.
[01:56:08] Speaker A: Hey, we're Browns fans. We're all angry.
We're, we're like the Hawk. I say this a lot too.
[01:56:13] Speaker B: We.
[01:56:14] Speaker A: How have we learned to cope? We're always angry.
So.
Yeah. But no, for this Sunday, let's, let's go ahead and go to this week's game. Obviously, they got the Bills. The Bills are a solid playoff team. The Browns are not.
Who again, speak freely. You're amongst friends. Who wins this Sunday and what is your score prediction?
[01:56:37] Speaker E: My score prediction?
I think. I actually think the Bills and I could get in trouble here in Toronto for saying this, given that it's a Bills down. But I think the Bills have not been as good of late as they were earlier in the season.
I think that we could be competitive. My, my prediction for the final score, though, unfortunately, Bill's 26. Seven, Browns 10.
[01:57:01] Speaker B: Yeah, it's mildly competitive.
[01:57:04] Speaker A: Yeah, that's mildly.
[01:57:05] Speaker F: Yeah.
[01:57:06] Speaker A: Are you. So you're probably thinking it's like. It's probably like 17:10 at halftime, and then we lose 27.
[01:57:11] Speaker E: That's what I'm thinking. And then.
[01:57:12] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, that's. That's fair.
[01:57:14] Speaker E: Yeah, I. I thought. You know what? I thought for the most part, we did a good job not letting things get completely out of hand yesterday. Like, at least they didn't put a 40 burger on us.
[01:57:25] Speaker A: Yeah, that's true. That's true.
[01:57:28] Speaker B: Jim, final question here. Just around the football stuff.
Good or bad move sending Shador Sanders out on the field without the right plays on his wrist.
[01:57:40] Speaker A: Bold strategy. Let's see if it pays off for him.
[01:57:42] Speaker C: Cotton.
[01:57:46] Speaker A: I will say this.
[01:57:47] Speaker E: At least we've seen enough to know that we have potentially something there, and that's got to at least make Browns fans. Fans feel good.
I'm not so sure I could say the same of Dylan Gabriel. If all we'd seen this season was Dylan Gabriel and we were going into next year with Dylan Gabriel as our starter, I think there'd be a lot of long faces around the table. Certainly there were here in Toronto.
[01:58:09] Speaker B: You know, Jim, I was feeling pretty bad about everything that's going on, but that actually made me feel better. So I appreciate that. It could be a hotter mess than it is if Dylan Gabriel was the only quarterback on our roster here right now.
[01:58:21] Speaker A: You know, what's wild about it, though, is there are still a contingent of Browns fans that swear. And I think it's mostly people that just don't like Shador Sanders because they don't like Shador Sanders that still say, go back to Dylan Gabriel. Shador Sanders isn't good. And, And. And I just. I. I would be. I'm with you. I would be so depressed if Dylan Gabriel was our future.
[01:58:44] Speaker E: Is it that they don't like Shador Sanders? Is it that they don't like downfield passing?
[01:58:52] Speaker A: Right. Like, it's all emotion.
[01:58:53] Speaker F: It's.
[01:58:53] Speaker A: They don't like Shador Sanders and probably Deion Sanders. But that's the. That's the thing, is we see downfield passes, we see good things happen when Shador is in the game, and we just don't. We don't see it when Dylan Gabriel's in there.
[01:59:04] Speaker B: It has been mildly more fun to watch.
[01:59:06] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah, I. I will say 31 to 3 was. Was better with Shador than it would be with Dylan Gabriel.
[01:59:13] Speaker E: I will say this certainly at my. At my chapter morale has improved significantly since Shooter Sanders took the field, if.
[01:59:21] Speaker D: That counts for anything.
[01:59:22] Speaker A: Like Absolutely.
[01:59:23] Speaker B: There's almost a little light at the.
[01:59:24] Speaker A: End of the tunnel until this past week when the. When the defense gave up and then everybody was kind of like, well.
[01:59:31] Speaker B: Final question before we wrap up, Jim. Does Miles get the sack record this year?
[01:59:35] Speaker E: Oh, yeah, absolutely. In fact, I think he might get it this week.
[01:59:39] Speaker B: Love it.
[01:59:40] Speaker A: Nice.
Well, Jim, it's been awesome talking with you. We wish we could stay on all night with you, but unfortunately we. We have a long production that we have to put together for all these wonderful Browns fans out here.
[01:59:51] Speaker D: But.
[01:59:52] Speaker A: But next time we are in Toronto, which I don't know when that will be because I haven't been to Toronto.
But if we do make it up to Toronto and it happens to be a Sunday, you know, we're stopping in at shocks and seeing you guys, I.
[02:00:02] Speaker E: Would love to welcome you guys. Thank you so much for having me on your show. I really appreciate it.
[02:00:07] Speaker A: Thanks, Jim.
[02:00:07] Speaker B: Thanks, Jim.
[02:00:12] Speaker E: We're the toronto brown spaggers. And you're listening. Listening to the burning river sportscast.
[02:00:16] Speaker B: Go browns.
[02:00:21] Speaker A: Ah, good time talking to Jim from the Toronto Brownsbackers, huh?
[02:00:24] Speaker B: Jim's an og.
[02:00:28] Speaker A: Angry Jimmy.
[02:00:28] Speaker B: Angry Jimmy. We got Angry Bobby. Angry Jimmy.
No.
[02:00:32] Speaker A: Is he your new favorite Canadian?
[02:00:35] Speaker B: I think so, yeah.
[02:00:36] Speaker A: Sorry, Kenny. Move over, Kenny.
[02:00:38] Speaker F: Matt.
[02:00:38] Speaker A: Angry Jimmy is the guy.
[02:00:40] Speaker B: Angry Jimmy was the guy.
No. Good. Good stuff. Great charities and stuff they're involved in up there. Ton of money raised.
[02:00:46] Speaker A: It's just amazing. Every time we keep adding this up in our heads over and over again, I'm like, that's just wild. How much. How much they do for charity.
[02:00:52] Speaker B: Huge economic impact each year.
[02:00:53] Speaker A: Yep. Let's go ahead and get into the Week 60 preview.
All right, guys, this week we've got no chance at all. I mean, we've got the Bills. That's what I meant to say. We have the Bills, Kenny. You know what it's time for? It's time for Kenny's clip notes.
What do you got for us, Kenny? All right, boys.
[02:01:22] Speaker B: We play the Bills this week.
[02:01:24] Speaker A: We do. We do.
[02:01:26] Speaker B: We're gonna get boat raced.
That. That's it. That's the Cliff Notes.
[02:01:32] Speaker A: That's the Cliff Notes.
[02:01:32] Speaker B: Seriously? There's no shot this week. The Bills are good. The Browns are asshole. It's gonna be 100 to zero.
[02:01:37] Speaker A: 100 is dang.
[02:01:38] Speaker B: That's all I got.
[02:01:39] Speaker A: Take the over.
No betting advice.
Is that Seriously.
[02:01:44] Speaker B: I got. That's all I got.
[02:01:45] Speaker A: Do you think there's you.
[02:01:46] Speaker B: You want me to break this down?
[02:01:48] Speaker A: No.
[02:01:48] Speaker B: You want me to talk about Josh Allen? A Perennial MVP candidate and their top ranked rushing game against, against the team that scored What, a combined 13 points in the last two weeks or whatever. Like we're gonna going to lose bad. We're going to lose real bad.
[02:02:04] Speaker C: That's it.
[02:02:04] Speaker A: And with every edition of Kenny's Cliff Notes comes another edition of Ronnie Jams.
[02:02:08] Speaker B: Matchups that matter.
[02:02:20] Speaker A: All right, I got two matchups for you. The one you already know, it's Miles Garrett versus the whoever's guarding him. Cuz he's chasing can't guard him. Yeah, he, he's, he, he's chasing history.
We both, we all said that we think he gets it this week. So he did seem to get banged up last week. So see, it'll be nice to see how he maybe not nice, but it'll. We'll see how he responds, I guess is how I should put.
[02:02:40] Speaker B: Miles doesn't get banged very often. I'm pretty sure he's the guy that does the banging.
[02:02:43] Speaker A: Yeah, punish.
[02:02:44] Speaker B: Yeah, punish.
[02:02:46] Speaker A: And then Shador versus the Bill secondary. Got another tough matchup for Shador this week, especially given the fact that you don't have a team around around you. But even besides that point, the secondary for the Bills is pretty solid. So if he could put up any stats whatsoever like that solidifies to me like this is the guy. Yeah, that's the guy we got.
[02:03:03] Speaker B: Fair enough.
[02:03:05] Speaker A: So in summary, the Bills coming off a win against this a solid Patriot squad.
You already talked about it. The Patriots were humping them down big and the Bills were down big, right. And came back and won. So their records 10 and 4 on defense, they're number 10 overall, number 2, 2 against the pass and number 28 against the run.
We don't have guys that could block anyways. We're not gonna run the ball on offense, they're number two in the NFL. Number one rushing attack as you mentioned, and the number 11 passing game. And then the Browns on the opposite end of this thing coming off loss to the Bears. They have a 311 record. Defensively they are still somehow. This is Monday that we're recording this, so it hasn't updated, but before this past week we were ranked number two in the NFL on defense, number 13 against the run and number one against the pass.
Offensively, still not good. Overall number 30.
Our rushing attack is number 27. Our passing attacks, 29. Browns are awful. Kevin Stefanski still the coach. Bubba Ventrona is still a special teams coordinator. Coordinator. And now our defense is asked because they too have completely given up. So. So there might be A way to. There's no way to win. But if there was a way to win, I bet Bone would be able to tell us what it was. So let's bring in the big Bone man, because it's time for Bone man.
[02:04:23] Speaker B: Skeleton key to victory.
[02:04:30] Speaker A: What do you got for us, Bone?
[02:04:33] Speaker C: I don't know where to go, guys. I'm kind of with Mr. Thunder over there.
[02:04:38] Speaker A: So respectful.
[02:04:40] Speaker C: There is no way to win.
Here's what I will say.
If Myles Garrett gets, I don't know, four sacks and our team combines for eight, maybe we get a scoop and score strip sack.
Maybe we can have a chance of winning.
I guess that's where I'm going.
[02:05:01] Speaker A: Nostradamus over here keeps getting more and more elaborate and they just keep coming true. Except we keep losing.
[02:05:06] Speaker C: Yeah, maybe that'll happen.
I think Miles is going to be getting after it and the D line is going to try to help him to do. Do that.
So if that happens, maybe we have a chance of victory.
[02:05:20] Speaker A: I didn't write down what your skeleton key to victory was last week. And if you nailed it again, I can't remember.
[02:05:25] Speaker C: I don't go back that far.
[02:05:27] Speaker B: Who knows?
[02:05:28] Speaker A: Who knows?
[02:05:28] Speaker B: I'm sure it came true.
[02:05:29] Speaker A: I guess that's. That's the skeleton key to victory.
[02:05:32] Speaker B: It's the skeleton key when there's no victory included.
[02:05:35] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. Kenny, you got the betting info for us?
[02:05:38] Speaker B: Bills minus ten and a half.
[02:05:40] Speaker A: Anytime you're in double digits is Bad News bears.
[02:05:42] Speaker B: Bad news bears.
[02:05:43] Speaker A: Well, that was last was the bad news Bears.
[02:05:45] Speaker B: But that's what we should have called the show the other night. Over. Under 40, two and a half.
[02:05:51] Speaker A: Players to watch.
I'll do mine. Miles Garrett. It's been Miles Garrett ever since he really had a chance to break the sack record. Now that he's here, it's still Miles Garrett. So, Kenny, who you got? You want to go back to store watch?
[02:06:02] Speaker B: No, I'm going to go a different direction this week.
I'm going to go Jerry Judy.
Jerry Judy was good last year.
[02:06:11] Speaker A: He was. That wasn't. That wasn't a figment of your imagination.
[02:06:14] Speaker B: This year has been a dis.
He can't catch the ball, his body language is poor.
And I'm basically at the end of my rope with Jerry Jeudy. Like Jerry Judy is one of those guys that I thought has talent, has a decent frame, is a guy that could contribute for this team. And I don't think he's a wide receiver one, but I. But I had hope that he could contribute to this team for years to come in some capacity. And I'm at the point point now where I'm at the end of my rope with Jerry Judy, and I just think maybe we're better off without him. But I'll give him one more week to prove to me that he's capable of redeeming himself, and we'll see what he does this week. Like, is he. Is he damaged goods and the Browns are better off to cut ties with asap, or is there still a possibility he could be a part of our future, future plans?
[02:07:10] Speaker A: We'll see.
[02:07:12] Speaker B: That's what I'm going with.
[02:07:13] Speaker A: Fair bone, who you got?
[02:07:16] Speaker C: Well, if Kenny Thunder is not taking Shador, I will take him. I do not really go defense here, but I want to see Shador playing another really good team.
Great passing defense, you know, how does he respond? Do we have receivers that can get open? I don't know. Is he going to be looking for harold Fanning another 14 times or sometimes whatever.
[02:07:41] Speaker A: Never going to be able to.
[02:07:43] Speaker C: Never going to be able to correct that.
[02:07:44] Speaker B: He can't get that g out of his mind.
[02:07:46] Speaker A: I can't wait till like, three years from now. We just make a montage of him saying, fanning, fanning, fanning, fanning.
[02:07:51] Speaker C: I mean, you guys already corrected me today, so, like, there's no. I can't.
[02:07:54] Speaker B: It's just subconscious at this point.
[02:07:56] Speaker D: Oh, man.
[02:07:57] Speaker C: But, yeah, how does Shador continue to respond? How does he look?
[02:08:02] Speaker A: Well, it's like I said, if he has any success whatsoever, this is a. This is the number two. I think I said pass defense in the league.
Is that right? Yeah, number. Number two, pass defense in the league. So if he has any shred of success against this team with as bad as the team is around him, like, you're the guy.
[02:08:21] Speaker C: I think he's shown the ability to. To put the ball in places only his guy can get it. If they catch it, that's on them.
I want to see more of that. And, yeah, throw his guys open, you know, do we got guys that can get to that point as receivers and tight ends? I don't think we do. So it's like, yeah, you just watch these other teams play throughout the week, and it's just we're so far from that and in our skill, position, ability.
[02:08:47] Speaker B: It would be nice if he could have a good game, a solid outing against a good football team. Just to kind of put to bed once and for all.
[02:08:54] Speaker A: It's never put it to bed once.
[02:08:56] Speaker B: Well, just to put the narrative for this year that like, he only plays good against bad teams. Like to have a solid outing against a good football team, which again is tough with all the things.
[02:09:05] Speaker C: Limit mistakes, make good decisions, protect the ball.
[02:09:08] Speaker B: Yeah. You don't got to win.
[02:09:09] Speaker C: But I'm hoping there's like. It's going to be cold. I think either way. Either in Cleveland or. Is it in Cleveland?
[02:09:15] Speaker B: Yeah.
[02:09:16] Speaker C: You know, I know it's warming up towards the end of the week. I don't know how it's going to look Sunday, but.
[02:09:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[02:09:21] Speaker C: Yeah. Hopefully there's at least some good conditions there where it's. It's practical for him to throw the ball.
[02:09:25] Speaker A: It would.
[02:09:26] Speaker B: It would be nice. I saw some really bad takes just on the Twitter sphere about. About the Jerry Judy throw that was intercepted. That the ball wasn't placed well. He should have put it toward to more to his back shoulder. And I'm just like, I don't know how you can throw a.
[02:09:43] Speaker A: That was like pinpoint that I've seen.
[02:09:46] Speaker B: I've seen Tom Brady and Peyton Manning and these guys make a living on that throw. Yeah, that was as good as you can throw it. There's nowhere else you could put that ball. Even if he did throw it to the back shoulder that. That the DB was playing underneath and he was manned up like he was. He was that that was a defensible play because he would have undercut it at that point.
[02:10:03] Speaker C: Everybody who watched that play thought we scored a touchdown.
[02:10:06] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean the ball hits your receiver in the numbers in the hands.
[02:10:10] Speaker A: I feel like even the announcer, like that's.
[02:10:13] Speaker B: They were confused. They were like a touchdown. Browns interception. Thanks.
[02:10:18] Speaker A: Apparently it was bathroom.
Let's move on to king of the North.
All right, John, thank you for joining us. Looking good as always.
[02:10:43] Speaker F: Appreciate it.
[02:10:44] Speaker A: Guys.
Jesus come from. Was it king culture?
[02:10:48] Speaker F: No, today, man. I took my kids to the. The zoo. We're out there in the cold, man. Got through it, man. It was good, good time. Good. Good family outing.
[02:10:56] Speaker B: So that's the zoo cut. John looks that good after spending all day at the zoo.
[02:11:01] Speaker A: Damn good jeans.
[02:11:03] Speaker F: You know, had on the whole day too, man. Came and tell, right?
[02:11:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
Listen, it was a polar vortex today. I don't know what you were doing out at a zoo, but wouldn't you have rather been in the barber shop?
[02:11:17] Speaker F: Yeah, most definitely. I would definitely been behind the chair if I had it my way, but the kids wanted to go to the zoo, man, so.
[02:11:22] Speaker C: Nice.
[02:11:23] Speaker B: Who was colder, you or the penguins?
[02:11:26] Speaker F: Right.
Probably my 2 year old.
[02:11:30] Speaker A: Yeah. How far did you guys make it through the zoo before? They were just like, we're ready. We're ready to go.
[02:11:35] Speaker F: I was actually surprised, man. My. My daughter wanted to call before me. She's four. She was like, are we going home? I was like, yeah, yeah, let's just go home.
[02:11:43] Speaker A: Good idea. This is your call. Yeah.
[02:11:47] Speaker F: Me, not her.
[02:11:48] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, listen, before we. Before we get into King of the north, we have to ask you. You know, obviously, the game this week was a rough one to watch.
[02:11:58] Speaker B: I mean, we didn't win.
[02:11:59] Speaker A: No, we did not win. We lost badly.
And after the game, you know, Shador Sanders getting a lot of unwarranted hate and blame for the game.
[02:12:09] Speaker B: I told you so.
[02:12:10] Speaker A: Yeah. So just. Just curious your thoughts on the game overall, and then also just. Just on Shador, and if you can really take this into account when you're evaluating him, given, you know, the conditions, the. The. How poorly the entire team played around him.
[02:12:26] Speaker B: All those things.
[02:12:27] Speaker A: All of those things.
[02:12:29] Speaker F: Yeah. Yeah. And you hit it on the head, right. It's not just Shador being evaluated right now. It's the entire team. So I'm sure that they had a lot of film to watch and a lot of things to go over and, you know, like, we've been talking about before, man, this. This time of the year now, especially where the Browns are at, it's just an evaluation, really, for next year and what they're going to do to take into the next year. So, you know, it's. It's something they got to figure out in Film City, of course, man. But it's probably not going to be too pretty.
[02:12:54] Speaker A: Yeah. Is so on the Shador front, though. I mean, do you really put a lot of stock into that game, or is it more so you kind of just cleans. You know, you go back to almost throwing that game out and saying, we're evaluating on everything else.
[02:13:08] Speaker F: Can never throw a game out. I mean, it was played. They.
You had a whole week to prep for it.
But at the same time, I don't think, you know, you throw everything away after a game.
You have to assess and move on to the next week. And just hopefully, you know, with these reps, you know, hopefully he's getting better and improving.
And.
[02:13:28] Speaker A: Last question on this week's stuff, kind of tying it back to when you were playing for the Browns as a player.
[02:13:36] Speaker B: How.
[02:13:38] Speaker A: Frustrating or what are your feelings on fans?
You know, they. They just. So they flip flop. And it goes from, you know, last week, Shador threw for 365 yards three touchdowns and ran for another one. And it was like, oh, we got to build around this guy. And this week after, after that performance, the, the sky is falling and I told you so and we need to get rid of him as soon as possible and go back to Dylan Gabriel.
So, so that's. How do you feel as a player when you hear those things?
[02:14:07] Speaker F: Well, at first, you know, when I was a younger player, I, you know, you get upset because, you know, you're, you're constantly. That's, that's really how you're, you're judging this game, right. You're being critiqued by other people, but luckily the other people aren't the fans. Right.
And I say that to say I used to take it to heart more as a player in the beginning of my career with the fans because, you know, we're out there playing in front of the fans for the fans, fans. But at the same time, you have to understand every game you, you go in, you prepare for you play. No matter what happens, you have to learn, assess, and move on to the next one. A big thing for me, my, my. One of my coaches actually told me this. He wasn't my coach when I got drafted, but he ended up being my coach eventually. And he told me he's like. One of the knocks that we had on you coming out was that you wore your emotions on your sleeve, right? Being able to, to. You weren't able to really snap and clear to the next one. We could tell what kind of play you had the play before by how you kind of acted going on to that next play. So really having a snap and clear mentality, man, no matter how good or how bad you played, you have to be able to snap and move on to the next one.
[02:15:13] Speaker A: Yeah, so that's, that's interesting.
[02:15:15] Speaker B: John, real quick, just final question around this, just the current state of the defense too. I mean, it looks like, you know, the last two weeks especially have had difficulty stopping the run. I mean, anything that you see out there in particular, particular, obviously the Titans didn't have a very good rushing game and had a career day. Chicago has a pretty good one, two punch, but the results were the same regardless. I mean, anything in particular you're seeing either scheme wise or is it personnel wise? I know Malik Collins went down. Like, what do you think the. Or is it just like the, you know, a 1, 2, 3, Cancun. Like what's, what's going on with the, the inability to stop the run right now?
[02:15:52] Speaker F: Honestly, it could be a million different things. But from, you know, just initially, what I saw, it was just hunkered down and being able to stop the run. I mean, sometime times it's not like a. A secret, a magic, you know, recipe that you come up with. Like, it's just, you know, being able to control your gap, control your man playing, playing man on man, bone on bone. And sometimes it just didn't go your way. I know they're gonna have a lot to look at, like I said before, but it was. Wasn't our best show in the past couple weeks in the run. And as a defensive lineman, you know, stopping the run was first and foremost.
So that's really discouraging to see From. From the. From the defense.
[02:16:29] Speaker A: Absolutely. And I know after last week's game, Miles Garrett said that they didn't earn the right to rush the passer because they didn't stop the run. So for the most part, did it again this week.
[02:16:39] Speaker F: Yep.
[02:16:41] Speaker A: But. All right, let's get into King of the North. That's what everybody's here for.
In case anyone doesn't know by now, this is our year long AFC north, pick them competition at the end of the season. Whoever comes in last place gets punished. In the preseason two years ago, Kenny had a gross eggs thrown at him by fans in the meeting lot before a game. Preseason. Last year, Kenny had his hair and beard.
His hair and beard shaved clean off a few weeks ago for losing this past season, Kenny donned the pads for the first time in almost 20 years and got hit three times by our guy, Big John Hughes.
[02:17:11] Speaker B: That man will never get old.
[02:17:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
How'd that feel, Kenny?
[02:17:16] Speaker B: Feels great.
[02:17:19] Speaker A: And then this year, the loser will be getting a Brazilian wax. And now I just. Just. We'll get to records in a minute, but Kenny, are you excited to get a Brazilian wax, John?
[02:17:28] Speaker B: Do you guys do that in any of your studios there? Do you have somebody we can. We can hook up with for this? Yeah, that's.
[02:17:34] Speaker F: That's one service that we kind of stay away from in King culture, man, is. Is the Brazilians. Maybe focus more up top. Not really down low.
[02:17:42] Speaker A: Ah, upper half.
[02:17:43] Speaker B: Yeah, we gotcha.
[02:17:45] Speaker A: Find someone else.
[02:17:47] Speaker C: Really good business decision there.
[02:17:49] Speaker F: I wonder. There's a lot of good places that take care of you though.
[02:17:52] Speaker A: So John, don't forget we have to film this. So are you looking forward to being in the room with Kenny?
[02:17:57] Speaker F: Oh my gosh. This.
[02:17:59] Speaker B: We could. We could really traumatize someone with this.
[02:18:02] Speaker F: Yeah.
[02:18:04] Speaker A: But let's go ahead and get into things. Not Kenny's things, but other Things first things first, I want to remind everyone that Bone is the reigning defending king of the North.
Kenny, you're a clown.
[02:18:15] Speaker B: Thank you.
[02:18:16] Speaker A: And let's remind everyone of the current standings. After week 15, Bone is on top again at 30 and 16.
I am sitting at 28 and 18. John, you are also 28 and 18 and Kenny is at 20 and 26.
So in case anyone's doing the math, we haven't figured the Pittsburgh game into these standings from Monday night because we're recording on Monday night. So it's happening as we're. As we're speaking.
So if you include the Pittsburgh game and the rest of the games in the season, there are 10 games left for Kenny to close that game.
So, Kenny, are you feeling good about this?
[02:18:53] Speaker B: Don't call it a comeback.
[02:18:54] Speaker F: We won't.
[02:18:56] Speaker A: So let's go ahead and get into this week's games.
We'll start with Baltimore hosting the Patriots and I will go ahead and go first and that way Kenny can go last here.
I am going to take the Patriots in this one. Baltimore, although they beat the the Bengals this past week, they just do not look the same. Lamar Jackson does not look the same. The defense, defense has been ass pretty much all year. Somehow they held the Bengals to zero points, though, so maybe they're turning it around. But overall, I trust the Patriots more and I'm gonna go Patriots. John, who you got?
[02:19:32] Speaker F: Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna have to go Patriots too. And just because the veg has been playing good ball, kind of like we were talking about with Chicago last week, we talked about teams that, you know, were playing well that no one, no one saw coming out of the blue from the beginning of the year. And Pach has been playing good, good ball. Everybody's got him going over there. And, and just with Lamar coming back, we didn't really see that spark that we thought we were going to see with. With his return. And like you said, even though they got past the Bengals and they. They looked well, I think the Patriots are just rolling too much right now to. To get stopped by Baltimore. So I'm going to go Patriots on this one. Bone.
[02:20:12] Speaker C: Yeah, I agree.
Patriots had a tough loss this past weekend, so I just don't see him losing again. They're. They're pretty good football team, so I think they got Baltimore this week.
[02:20:24] Speaker A: All right. And Kenny, I'm going to ask you two questions.
Who would you pick and who are you going to pick?
[02:20:32] Speaker B: Well, of course I would pick the Patriots because they're probably going to be the top seed in the AFC this year, but I'm crossing my fingers for the upset. The comeback becomes. Begins here. Let's go, Baltimore.
Let's go, Kenny.
[02:20:44] Speaker C: Anybody can do it. It's Lamar.
[02:20:46] Speaker A: Yep.
[02:20:46] Speaker D: Yep.
[02:20:47] Speaker A: All right. And then next up here, we got Cincinnati traveling to Miami. I'm gonna start with John. Who you got?
[02:20:54] Speaker F: Oh, Cincinnati, Miami.
I feel like Burrow.
I think Burrow's gonna have a comeback on this one after last week. It was a rough one.
I. I'm gonna take the Bengals on this one.
[02:21:07] Speaker A: Bone, who you got?
[02:21:10] Speaker C: My first thought was Miami.
Just because they're home. Home team. And is it a chain or. How do you say that guy's last name? Does that sound right?
A chain? Yeah. I don't know. He's a stud, so I could see him having a. Having a good night.
[02:21:24] Speaker A: So you're going Miami. Yeah, I'm going Miami because you said it. You said at first I was going to go Miami, and then you didn't finish the thoughts.
[02:21:29] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. You lose track of time. Space in the middle of my sentence.
[02:21:33] Speaker B: I lost track of my thoughts.
[02:21:35] Speaker A: That's fair. I'm gonna go next. I'm gonna let you go last. Kenny. I am gonna go with the Dolphins in this one, actually. No, I'm not, because I want to catch bone, so I'm gonna go Bengals.
[02:21:43] Speaker C: Nice.
[02:21:44] Speaker A: That's the only reason I had the Dolphins, but I guess go Joe Burrow. Kenny, we got.
[02:21:54] Speaker B: Dolphins are at home in this one, right?
[02:21:56] Speaker A: Yes, they are. Yeah.
[02:21:56] Speaker B: Let's go. Let's go, Dolphins.
[02:21:58] Speaker A: That lined up well for you to be able to go against me and John, who are closest to you.
[02:22:01] Speaker B: Yeah, that was.
[02:22:01] Speaker F: Yeah. Dude.
[02:22:04] Speaker A: We got to really think about this guy. Hold him off here.
[02:22:06] Speaker F: I was just about to say, man, you're the one that said Kenny can go last every time now, man. Now you put us at a disadvantage.
[02:22:13] Speaker A: Yeah, well, as long as me and you pick opposite, it pretty much screws him because he. He's got to decide who he's going after.
He has one bad week of that, then it's all over. So you guys.
[02:22:23] Speaker B: You guys start playing your games, and you're going to end up getting a Brazilian wax.
[02:22:26] Speaker A: I will never get a Brazilian. Wall laps.
All right, next up, we got Pittsburgh traveling to Detroit. I Bone, you'll go first to hear.
[02:22:36] Speaker C: Detroit, Detroit, home. Better football team. They're gonna. They're gonna win by a lot.
[02:22:43] Speaker A: All right, I have. I have the exact same thing and all the exact same thoughts.
Pittsburgh, I think, are pretenders. The Lions. Even though they've had a rough stretch in the middle of the season here, where they lost a few games, I think the Lions are the real deal. So I'm going to go go Lions. John, who you got?
[02:23:00] Speaker F: Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna have to go to Detroit here, too. Pittsburgh has been up and down, mostly down this year, and sure, even though they had a. A bad, not a great game last game, I feel like they're going to bounce back and have a nice run toward the end of the year. And I'll start with Pittsburgh. So. Got lying.
[02:23:17] Speaker A: Jenny, who would you pick and who are you going to pick?
[02:23:21] Speaker B: Detroit and Pittsburgh.
Is that the matchup?
[02:23:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[02:23:25] Speaker B: Just want to make sure I'm on the right.
[02:23:27] Speaker C: Yeah.
[02:23:29] Speaker E: Yeah.
[02:23:29] Speaker B: I mean, Detroit probably wins this game, so clearly I gotta go Pittsburgh.
[02:23:34] Speaker A: This is my favorite part of the season. Just watch them just. Just squirm over there like, oh, God.
[02:23:40] Speaker B: Aaron Rodgers gonna light it up.
[02:23:42] Speaker D: Okay.
[02:23:43] Speaker C: Keep them playoff hopes alive.
[02:23:45] Speaker B: Yeah, there you go.
[02:23:46] Speaker A: They got to get back to 500, right?
[02:23:48] Speaker B: Yeah, they got to be over 500.
[02:23:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
All right. And then the final game, obviously we're hosting the Bills. I don't know how you can possibly pick the Browns in this, but you're going to. But I'll start things off. I'm gon Bills in this one, and it is not close. It is going to be really, really bad. I got the. The Bills. I'm being generous here, going 34 to 10.
John, who you got?
[02:24:09] Speaker F: Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna have to go Bills in this one, too.
Man, the past couple games for the Browns have been rough, especially defensively, which is surprising, man, you know, when I have one of the top defense in the league, so it's hard to really trust our defense right now. And then, you know, with offense, we struggled putting any points on the board last week, so I'm going to have to go Bills with this one. I got a score 28 7.
[02:24:37] Speaker A: Bone, who you got?
[02:24:38] Speaker C: I also go in Bills.
Just. Yeah, really good football team. Josh Allen's going to be hard to stop. Hopefully Miles brings him down a couple times, so I'm going to go Bill's 27, Browns 17.
[02:24:52] Speaker A: And Kenny, they got in this one.
[02:24:55] Speaker B: Look, there's just no chance the Browns win this weekend. It's just not going to happen. I can't pick the Browns to win. Bills, Bills over Browns.
Let's go 38, 13 before you finish.
[02:25:07] Speaker F: Kenny, hold on one second. So you said there's no way that the Browns win, right? I'm sure you know, everyone's saying the same thing against Green Bay and Cleveland earlier this year, right?
[02:25:18] Speaker A: That's true.
[02:25:18] Speaker F: That would have been a great game to switch it up. I mean, I'm just saying there's options there.
[02:25:23] Speaker B: You do have options, you know, John, I went there last week. Remember? The Brown Zone, the NFC North? That didn't work out well for me.
[02:25:34] Speaker A: This whole season hasn't worked out well for you, Kenny.
[02:25:36] Speaker B: Look, this week I'm going 4. 0. And if I just go undefeated every week, one of you guys getting waxed.
[02:25:41] Speaker A: You want to know the worst part about Kenny losing King of the north every year is I don't think he's ever been above.
[02:25:47] Speaker B: That's not true. I was about 500 last year, bro.
[02:25:50] Speaker A: Were you?
[02:25:50] Speaker B: I was. I just didn't win.
[02:25:52] Speaker F: Were you?
[02:25:53] Speaker B: I was.
[02:25:55] Speaker A: Promise Where I'm gonna look at the final standings right now. Talk amongst yourselves.
[02:26:01] Speaker B: All I know is if I just.
[02:26:03] Speaker C: Keep winners, real time fact check going on, huh?
[02:26:06] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't think he was so.
He was five. He was exactly. I said above. You haven't been above 500.
[02:26:13] Speaker B: Was 500.
[02:26:14] Speaker A: You were 28 and 28 last year to finish the season.
[02:26:16] Speaker B: There you go.
Point. Point me.
[02:26:20] Speaker A: I don't think so.
[02:26:20] Speaker B: We'll add that to my totals for this week.
[02:26:22] Speaker A: No.
[02:26:23] Speaker B: Yeah.
[02:26:23] Speaker A: No, point me. No, Just get ready to get waxed. John, thank you so much for joining us for. For King of the north this week.
We appreciate you being on. Will we see you again next week?
[02:26:37] Speaker F: Yeah, I should be on next week.
[02:26:39] Speaker A: Nice. Was that three weeks in a row of John Hughes?
[02:26:41] Speaker B: Looking forward to that. Back to back to back with John Hughes.
[02:26:44] Speaker A: John Hughes is a regular.
[02:26:45] Speaker B: We got to pull that one off on the next cruise. All three of us pissing with John.
[02:26:50] Speaker A: I don't know that the Browns fan cruise is a thing anymore. So.
[02:26:53] Speaker D: Yeah, I don't know.
[02:26:55] Speaker A: Yeah, we'll go on our own cruise.
[02:26:57] Speaker B: That's right.
[02:26:58] Speaker A: Family vacation.
[02:26:58] Speaker B: Take John with us on the family vacation.
[02:27:01] Speaker F: I know my family won't disagree, so we'll be good.
[02:27:05] Speaker A: All right, John, we appreciate it. Thank you.
[02:27:07] Speaker B: Thanks, John.
[02:27:07] Speaker C: Thanks, John.
[02:27:08] Speaker F: I appreciate it. Guys, take it easy.
[02:27:09] Speaker A: All right? So always fun having John on the show for King of the North. He will be back next week. So that's three weeks in a row with John Hughes. Back to back to back.
[02:27:19] Speaker B: John, he just always just looks nice.
[02:27:21] Speaker A: He's that dude. You know?
[02:27:23] Speaker B: He is that dude. Like CJ St.
You feel like that guy? Yeah, he feels like that guy. Yeah.
[02:27:30] Speaker A: John Hughes, here's our commitment to you. If we ever get rich and famous and go somewhere, we'll move you there with us, you know.
[02:27:37] Speaker F: Yeah.
[02:27:37] Speaker B: If we ever get more rich and more famous than you.
[02:27:42] Speaker A: That ain't happening.
With that. Let me remind everybody to call the Burning Sports guys.
3302-2780-8133-0227-808-1330-222780-81330, 2227-8813-3022-7881 call now. We are not standing by. We'll put you on the air. We'll talk about your taste.
[02:28:00] Speaker B: We'll kick you in this Jimmy Haslam.
[02:28:02] Speaker A: If you don't kick you in the jimmies. And be sure to check out our gear. Www.thetepmedia.com back shop that'll do for us, Kenny. What can we expect next week?
[02:28:08] Speaker B: We'll be live live, live live. On Sunday night. Look for us live on YouTube, Facebook and X as we recap the Week 16 matchup against the Bills. Should be on right around 9:30. We are accepting Collins live callins. Please call the show and next Thursday we'll be back with our week's our Week 1717 preview episode for the game against not the Bills, the Steelers I believe.
[02:28:27] Speaker A: Steelers.
Right?
[02:28:29] Speaker B: Is that right?
[02:28:29] Speaker A: Right?
[02:28:30] Speaker B: Is that right?
[02:28:31] Speaker A: Is that right?
[02:28:31] Speaker B: It is the Steelers. Yes, yes.
[02:28:33] Speaker A: Get the Steelers.
[02:28:34] Speaker B: Good thing we're prepared. So yeah, listen to the show. We'll have another Brownsbackers interview TBD and follow along for all the other things. You listen to the Burning River Sportscast for like the same takes over and over and over and over and over again.
[02:28:46] Speaker A: And check us out on social media. Tap me on Facebook X and Instagram at the T Media Burning Sportscats that's this podcast on Facebook, Instagram, Tik Tok and YouTube at Burning Sportscast on X as well at the handle at Burning Pod you can find our podcast. We podcast app 5 at Spotify's YouTube Music Amazon Music Stitcher, Pandora Radio podcast Castro Good pods. We are number ranked football podcast. So many more reviews are the best things that you can leave us to help our podcast grow. Please keep supporting. We'll continue to grow together, tweak our formula when necessary and keep bringing you the best damn Cleveland Browns pod in the land. Do you know what that takes us to Kenny?
[02:29:17] Speaker B: Facts for days.
[02:29:20] Speaker D: Facts for days.
[02:29:32] Speaker A: Kenny, what do you got for us?
[02:29:34] Speaker B: I got some facts for days.
[02:29:35] Speaker A: I want to hear your facts for days.
[02:29:37] Speaker B: You want to hear my facts?
[02:29:38] Speaker A: Remember when Theo Vaughn's dad was like 116 years old?
[02:29:43] Speaker B: I love facts for days. Number one.
Sea otters.
[02:29:46] Speaker A: Ooh, this is gonna be good.
[02:29:49] Speaker B: Hold hands.
[02:29:50] Speaker A: Yes.
[02:29:50] Speaker B: While they sleep.
[02:29:51] Speaker A: So they don't lose each other.
[02:29:52] Speaker B: Drift away from each other. This vital survival beh keeps them together for safety and warmth. And if they don't have a buddy, they often will entangle themselves in kelp. Oh, to stay anchored.
[02:30:05] Speaker A: That's a fun one.
[02:30:07] Speaker B: Sea otters. Who knew? Number two. Number two, here's some human evolution for you.
According to research.
[02:30:17] Speaker A: Whose research?
[02:30:18] Speaker B: You know, science.
[02:30:19] Speaker A: Oh. Okay.
[02:30:20] Speaker B: Today, nearly 80% of us dream in color.
Before color television, around 15% of us did.
The widespread availability of color photography, film, and especially color television seems to have trained our brains to expect and produce color in dreams. Shifting the norm, however, before monochromatic entertainment.
[02:30:46] Speaker A: That's what I was gonna ask.
[02:30:47] Speaker B: And writings by historical figures like. Like Aristotle, Freud often described the presence of color in their dreams. So we went from color to watching black and white television that then shifted our brains to be able to dream in black and white to back to color, where we now dream in vivid colors.
[02:31:09] Speaker C: That's wild.
[02:31:11] Speaker A: This is one of your better facts of all times.
[02:31:13] Speaker B: And it's still even generational today. Because if you look at older generations, when surveyed, a higher percentage, close to 40 of them, still claim that they dream in black and white versus younger generations, that very few. It's in the low, you know, tens that have said they've ever dreamt in black and white and mostly dreaming color.
[02:31:30] Speaker A: I've never dreamt in black. I don't have a lot of dreams to begin with. I know a lot of people that have a lot of dreams. I don't have a lot of dreams. I've had one, maybe the past, like 10 years. But anyways, it was in color.
[02:31:39] Speaker B: It's just wild that you think about all of human history. Like all you knew was color. So you dream, dream in color. All of a sudden we introduce, like, this new stimuli, and we're like, our brains get trained, and we don't think color exists anymore because we're so inundated with black and white media, photos and movies to color is reintroduced. And now we dream in color again.
[02:32:01] Speaker A: That's wild.
[02:32:02] Speaker B: Facts for days.
[02:32:03] Speaker A: Number three.
[02:32:06] Speaker B: As if we needed one more reason for this. You're less likely to have a traffic accident when daylight savings time ends. Statistics show that the extra hour of sleep reduces accidents. On average, accidents increase by about 6% the week following the shift to daylight savings time. Studies consistently show this rise in traffic incidents, particularly fatal ones, are linked to factors Such as sleep deprivation and disruptions to circadian rhythms.
Many of these daylight savings time collisions also involve deer due to to the time coinciding with peak deer activity. One University of Washington study estimates that the permanent adjustment to daylight savings time would Prevent an estimated 36,000 deer deaths, over 30 human deaths, and 2,000 injuries annually.
And 1.19 billion in costs would be saved each year. And that's in Washington alone.
As a bonus fact, gentleman deer related vehicle collisions there are in the US each year. No. Over 2 million.
[02:33:15] Speaker A: Extrapolate that.
[02:33:16] Speaker C: That's like, I'm for this change. I totaled a car this year hitting a deer. And it was rather scary.
[02:33:24] Speaker A: Yeah. So like daylight savings. Like they're talking about, like, not what.
[02:33:28] Speaker B: We'Re on right now. Right.
[02:33:29] Speaker A: Like they don't want it to be this.
I do want it to stay this.
[02:33:33] Speaker B: So there's daylight savings time and then there's standard time.
So in. I think we've. I think we're.
[02:33:39] Speaker C: We fall back.
[02:33:40] Speaker B: We fall back to.
Now I've got my brain confused. Here's what I do know is that on standard time, when the study was done, the estimates were actually reversed as more deer deaths double. So over 60,000 deer deaths would occur on standard time. And the cost would be in excess of $2 billion each year. And the human deaths and injuries would double as well to close to 70 or so human deaths and over 4,000 injuries. If you go to standard time versus daylight savings time is a permanent adjustment.
[02:34:15] Speaker A: All I know is I like the one where they don't make it dark at 5 o'.
[02:34:19] Speaker F: Clock.
[02:34:21] Speaker B: Like, all I know is I like my extra hour of sleep. And that's facts for days.
[02:34:26] Speaker A: Wow.
[02:34:27] Speaker B: Good facts hurt my brain today. Those were facts about sleep.
[02:34:32] Speaker A: Oh, there's a theme.
There's a theme.
[02:34:35] Speaker B: Otter streams. Accidents.
[02:34:37] Speaker A: Don't want to close my eyes.
[02:34:39] Speaker B: I don't think we're to that point.
[02:34:42] Speaker C: I'm too sleepy to sing Bonita Bon Appetit.
[02:34:49] Speaker B: Don't just be a part of the problem, B. The whole damn problem.
[02:34:53] Speaker A: And only you can prevent river fires.
I don't want to close my eyes.
I don't want to fall asleep.
[02:35:09] Speaker B: Cause I miss you, baby.
[02:35:11] Speaker A: And I'm done.
[02:35:12] Speaker B: Want to miss a thing.
Good night, Cleveland.
[02:35:16] Speaker A: Good night.
[02:35:16] Speaker C: Good night, Akron.
[02:35:18] Speaker A: Quiet on set.
[02:35:19] Speaker D: I now have two loves in my life.
[02:35:23] Speaker A: Big city living and a voodoo woman named Phyllis. I didn't think we'd be getting into Brad Pitt's ass.
[02:35:31] Speaker B: I can't even say I didn't think we'd Be getting into Brad Pitt's ass.
[02:35:35] Speaker A: Yeah. Didn't think we'd get in there.
[02:35:38] Speaker B: We talk a lot of analingus on this show.
[02:35:40] Speaker A: So put your right foot in and take your right foot out. Then put your right foot in and shut the hell up, because it's not time for the hokey pokey. It's time for the Burning river Sports Cat. Motorboat. You play the motorboat?
You motorboat? Son of a.
[02:35:56] Speaker B: You old seal. Are you. You know, I was thinking during that interview.
[02:35:58] Speaker E: What?
[02:35:59] Speaker A: What were you thinking? Nothing. Because you don't have thoughts because you're a brainless idiot.
[02:36:03] Speaker B: Wow.
[02:36:04] Speaker A: My name is Uhtred. Son of Uhtred, by the way. I want my foreskin back.
[02:36:11] Speaker B: Women's Guide to. To Anal Sex. And it was the second edition. Who makes that second edition?
[02:36:17] Speaker C: The weather outside is weather.
[02:36:19] Speaker A: The other one.
[02:36:19] Speaker B: The finger.
[02:36:20] Speaker A: The finger. Eating food. Fingers. Oh, my God. My ass is full of shed everywhere.
[02:36:27] Speaker C: Yes.
[02:36:27] Speaker B: Ejaculate all over. Over my body and my genitals.
[02:36:30] Speaker C: Yes.
[02:36:30] Speaker A: Oh, no.
[02:36:32] Speaker B: We suck again.
[02:36:33] Speaker C: You don't need fundamentals when you got heart.
[02:36:36] Speaker B: And Jesus.
[02:36:37] Speaker A: And Jesus.
[02:36:38] Speaker C: That's right.
[02:36:39] Speaker A: Touchdown, number one.
[02:36:40] Speaker B: What do you mean funny?
[02:36:41] Speaker F: Funny how?
[02:36:42] Speaker B: How am I funny?
[02:36:42] Speaker A: It's going down. I'm yelling.
[02:36:45] Speaker B: Timber.
[02:36:48] Speaker A: Should we start a meat podcast? Like. Like. Like. Like the meat pod Slow roasted?
[02:36:56] Speaker D: The leads are weak. Leads are weak.
Leads are weak.
[02:37:02] Speaker B: That we should send a team of oil core drillers a la Armageddon, to Mars to have them access the newly discovered reservoirs of water trapped 7 to 12 miles under the surface that, when released, will cover the entirety of everything on the planet less than a mile high.
[02:37:11] Speaker A: All I do is win, win, win, no matter what. Erroneous. Erroneous on both counts.
[02:37:16] Speaker E: Oh, Lord.
[02:37:17] Speaker A: I mean, when I. Last year, when I won and went home, you know, know my wife's pants hit the ground.
[02:37:21] Speaker B: Wow.
[02:37:22] Speaker A: But damn.
[02:37:23] Speaker B: I'm sorry I hijacked your segment for a second to do some good podcasting.
You know why, Mr. Cuz? You drove a Hyundai.
[02:37:31] Speaker D: To get here tonight, I drove an $80,000 BMW.
[02:37:35] Speaker B: That's my name.
[02:37:36] Speaker A: I think we've officially lost all of our more conservative viewers, so I don't think they want to listen any longer.
[02:37:43] Speaker C: This is.
[02:37:43] Speaker A: This is just happening.
[02:37:44] Speaker C: It's Mother Nature.
[02:37:45] Speaker A: Live my life a quarter mile at a time.
[02:37:47] Speaker B: Where's Logo girl when you need her? I desperately want to make love to Cheese Girl. We need Cheese Girl now. Down, go, Sanderson. Down, go, Sanderson. Who's canceled now?
Who's canceled now?
[02:37:59] Speaker A: Probably me.
[02:38:00] Speaker B: You making a photo of fat people.
[02:38:02] Speaker A: I'm not just you.
[02:38:04] Speaker B: We're a whole race, basically.
[02:38:08] Speaker A: No way. You're just straight. Just finger banging ourselves. Salad.
[02:38:11] Speaker F: What?
[02:38:12] Speaker C: Sa you first get shocked and then you get the shocker.
[02:38:19] Speaker B: You like to see almost naked.
[02:38:20] Speaker A: That's cool, man.
[02:38:21] Speaker E: Whatever.
[02:38:21] Speaker C: No, no, no, no, no.
[02:38:23] Speaker A: Most people like they're driving along and they're like in between meals, like, I'm a little hungry. I'm going to have a granola bar. And he's like, I need a cheeseburger.
Are you not entertained?
Are you not entertained?
[02:38:36] Speaker B: Is this not why you were here?
[02:38:48] Speaker A: Today's episode was brought to you by Topath American Gin.
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